Camshaft breakin, specifically flat tappet stuff.

[cstraub]

What are all of you doing? I posted on a website and was just about burned at the stake for overfilling the crank case and letting the crank splash some oil on the cam for extra lubrication.

Since Eaton quit making them and Hi-Lift/ Johnson was shut down the stuff out their is scarey. I find the Mauressa lifter holds a much better crown then the non existant Stanadyne. I use the EDM stuff mostly with good customers and Andy's stuff and PPP for the guy willing to spend $450 for a set of tool steel.

Feedback?

Chris

PS. When I can let the cat out, I will let you all know about the '07 vette engine. We got the prints on it for some R&D we are doing for GM.

[speedtalk]

Factors you can control after the engine is in the car:

1) Lubrication
2) RPM
3) Force

So for each:

1) Not much you can do here. If adding extra oil doesn't become an aeration problem for bearings (I'm guessing it won't at idle), I'd say go for it.
2) Run at idle. You no longer need extra RPM because of #1
3) Use lower ratio rockers.

Just my thoughts.

[rmbuilder]

Anyone doing run-in with single springs?
Bob

[speedtalk]

Anyone doing run-in with single springs?
Bob

Yes, thanks for adding that Bob.

[guest]

i have never had a cam wipe out in over twenty years . untill recently ! there is a definate problem with current lifters ! i used up all my eaton lifters three months ago , (i had several trays of them ) then i was forced to use current market lifters and the last two engines wiped cams ! has anybody used the CMD-HIGH PRESSURE LUBE #3 for a cam lube ? i was thinking about trying it because of what i had read about it . i got some now and it seems kind of thick , wich would be good because it wont drip of the cam before break in and it seems to proclaim more pressure resistance than anything on the market ?

[speedtalk]

has anybody used the CMD-HIGH PRESSURE LUBE #3 for a cam lube ?

No, but I use it in plenty of other locations - good stuff.

Since we're on the subject, how about the relation between the lifter crown and the lobe taper? I've tried different tapers in the past - not sure that I learned anything

[ShaunTiede/UltraDyne]

Assuming the lifter bore angles are true, I have been having great results doing the following for a flat tappet break in: I clean everything in Lacquer Thinner. Then I coat the base of the lifters and the lobes with the Moly lube that A.R.P. supplies with their rod bolts. I put a coat of 5W20 oil such as SuperFlow or Havoline on the lifter body and the lifter bores. Then I put that oil in the pan for start up. Pre lube the system, start it up, and Idle it at 2Grand. Works great. It stopped anyone calling me with this issue. You can't break in a flat tappet cam with synthetic oil. The oil is so slick that it keeps the lifter from rotating which tracks it. Some may have done it and dodged a bullet, but you try it on one of our high peak rate ramps with any sort of spring pressure and you'll be sorry.

[speedtalk]

You can't break in a flat tappet cam with synthetic oil. The oil is so slick that it keeps the lifter from rotating which tracks it.

Hey Shaun, Thanks for stopping by the forum.

I never thought of synthetic being a problem for the cam. Thanks for sharing your experience.

[bsfc9]

has anyone heard about oil companies being required by the epa to remove certain anti-wear substances(phosphorus and zinc)from current oils(mineral based) and this leading to increased flat tappet cam wear and failure?

[Guest]

Yes that is true, but from what i understand its only being removed from highway oils, or non-racing oils. Apparently zinc and catalytic convertors don't mix. Most vehicles have roller cams these days and don't need the zinc anyway. They don't care about the rest of us.

[learner]

Sorry, forgot to log in above.

[bsfc9]

learner, you mentioned "highway or non-racing" oils, so do you think for example valvoline's "race" oil is a better bet than regular valvoline, and are the other brands going to market there own "race" oil. ive also heard talk about sales restrictions on oils that are not approved for highway use. is the good oil going to go the way leaded fuel?--sure i can get it for my hot street car just not as easily or as cheap.

[learner]

I don't know for sure. I would suspect the racing oil would be better due to better or closer manufacturing tolerances. As far as zinc in highway oils, from what i understand you need to look for anything with an SJ or earlier rating. I'm told the SL's are zinc free. However, i do not have an oil contact per say.

[Lasher...]

Actually SL rated oils are not zinc free. A sample of oil can be sent to a lab and they can tell you some of the properties of your oil sample.

As an example here is an example of an SL rated 10W-30 I had done during 2003.These numbers are in Parts Per Million.

Molybdenum.......... = 46
Silicon................... = 2
Sodium................. = 1
Calcium................ = 1716
Magnesium............ = 11
Phosphorus ........... = 849
Zinc....................... = 947

SUS Viscosoity @ 210 F = 61
Flashpoint .................. = 430 deg F

SL rated oils have thier Phosphorus levels capped at 1000 PPM. The new GF-4 specs due out later this year will most likey be less than that. The EPA and other belive the Phosphorus is the leading killer of cat converters. Much of this Phosphorus comes from Zinc ( Zincdithiophosphate ).There is alot of debate that it's not really the PH 's fault but the vilotility of the oil instead......either way the new SM /GF-4 oils are very likely going to be a much different oil than the current crop of SL / GF-3 oils.

[bsfc9]

how about distributor drive gear failures linked to these changes in oil formulations? has anybody experienced this?