General engine tech -- Drag Racing to Circle Track
I am working on a case 148 gas engine and the sleeves have to sealing rings near the bottom of the sleeve.Info that comes with them says to use silicon spray to lube the bloack and put them in i have aslo heard of using dish soap. On the top of the sleeve there is no seals at all so i guess the head gasket seals the top of the sleeve to the block. Do you guys put any type of sealer under the sleeve flange? I know in this engine they want the sleeve .003 -.004 higher the the deck so you cant use anythink thick.
- Posts: 615
- Joined: Sat Oct 22, 2005 2:42 pm
- Location: Some where in this world
I have used dishwashing soap (Palmolive is my favorite for seals and inside of slicks), silicon spray, and in one case Permatex red high temp silicon.
We were rebuilding an old tractor block that was pitted where the seals should fit tight. I didn't know what else to do, we put a light coating of red sealer on the o rings pushed them in the block, installed an old head gasket and torqued the head in place. Let it sit in front of a heater all night. I was a little nervous, but it is still running, no leaks.
Most of the diesel truck mechanics I know use the soap.
- Posts: 198
- Joined: Sun Feb 13, 2005 11:27 am
drifter are the seals made of a rubber like material? If they are, I would use the silicone spray on both the seals, and the block. Don't use anything that might soften, or dissolve the seal. Good Luck. Dan.
- Posts: 990
- Joined: Mon Aug 07, 2006 9:31 am
- Location: usa
Back when I was a kid I worked at my uncles farm equipment shop. I helped the head mechanic alot. He used to put the sleeves/liners in the freezer before sliding them in the block.
- Posts: 245
- Joined: Mon Dec 13, 2004 6:24 pm
The counter bore area under the liner flange generally does not use sealer.
The typical thing to do is put the liner in without the seals, clamp it down with a hard bar and bolts, the check liner projection with a liner projection gauge or depth mic. If the liner is low or the counterbore area is pitted, it should be machined and shimmed back to spec.
If this is a "patch job" you can use a little thin liquid sealer under the flange, but beware that this usually does not last the expected service life.
The lower seal area should be clean. If it is pitted , fill the pits with JB weld or Devcon epoxy and hand sand them. When installing the liners, be sure the o-ring(s) are not twisted. Use a quality rubber lubricant (that tire installers use) or a mild liquid soap. I use a special tool to put them in, but a block of wood, an eyebolt in a head bolt hole and a prybar work fine. You just want a smooth steady push when installing.
"Nil Satis Nisi Optimum"
- Posts: 4558
- Joined: Sun Feb 19, 2006 10:19 am
- Location: MA
I would do like Keith recommended, by installing all sleeves without O-rings and check protrusion. On that engine your allowed .002 to .005 protrusion, but I like to see no more then .001 diffrence between cylinders. As long as you clean up the counter bore good you should not have to install anything under it, the lower sealing area should be pit free and a mild dish soap works well for installing the O- rings. If they are pitted filling with JB weld would work, or I perfer to bore them out and install part of a cylinder repair sleeve and bring it back to spec. There usually is pitting but sometimes the location is deceiving, can always take an old sleeve drill a few holes where the O ring grooves are drop them in and mark it, to see how bad the pitting is in the sealing area.
- Posts: 75
- Joined: Sat Dec 17, 2005 10:53 am
- Location: Michigan
[quote="Max Effort"] Use a quality rubber lubricant (that tire installers use) [/quote]
And that is pretty much Murphys Oil Soap, water and something to reduce corrosion last I checked.
I'd be real tempted just to use straight antifreeze as a lube.
Also be sure to fill the rad with antifreeze rated for engines with liners. There is some formulation difference that reduces corrosion in trapped areas like the base of the liners.
- Posts: 574
- Joined: Fri Dec 01, 2006 5:25 pm
For badly pitted lower bore area I have done the JB Weld deal as mentioned above, and no ill effects.
Johndeer sells special Soap for cylinder o-rings. On some Caterpillar engines there is an upper seal that is oiled with SAE30 so it will seal just below the counter bore.
For variance in protrusion height, you have to counter bore and shim.
Check for cracks in the counter bore area.
- Posts: 1630
- Joined: Thu Jun 01, 2006 8:51 pm
Do not use oil on the O-rings! Believe it or not Crisco works real well. Dave
- Posts: 255
- Joined: Sun Jul 18, 2004 6:34 am
- Location: Nielsville, Mn.
Return to Engine Tech
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: af2, brechlrl, CantedTexan, Carson Brummett, cgarb, Curtis Mc, Google [Bot], hajds, looper, machinedave, mreperf, narcotix, rz726, upstand2 and 22 guests