Faith is not a reliable path to truth

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GRTfast
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Faith is not a reliable path to truth

Post by GRTfast » Sat Jul 14, 2018 10:34 am

There is a show I watch on YouTube sometimes called “The Atheist Experience”. Like me, the host is a former southern baptist. I think this clip sums up how/why I became an atheist, and how/why religion is harmful and offensive.

A guy calls in from a local church concerned about the show and the effect it has on people. The hosts ask him some direct and fair questions, and he dances around the answers. Then the host lays out the truth and it is the most succinct and powerful version I’ve heard. Watch it. Comment or don’t. Just leaving it here as food for thought.

https://youtu.be/DtY4wWNZ7-Y

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Re: Faith is not a reliable path to truth

Post by j-c-c » Sat Jul 14, 2018 11:00 am

I see no need to convey my personal religious beliefs.

That being said, many seem to have a need for religion, in any shape or form, this is their rightful choice of course. I believe with my understanding of the human race, we collectively would be worse off if religion did not exist. As in doing the right thing, in and of itself, is not high on many peoples list. Religion often provides that extra motivation with some future payback, and it appears there are many many flavors of religions to choose from.

My day to day concern on religion mainly centers on how others beliefs effect me, and others, not the believers. :)

Asking for the same in return is where the problems often arise.

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Re: Faith is not a reliable path to truth

Post by GRTfast » Sat Jul 14, 2018 11:31 am

j-c-c wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 11:00 am
I believe with my understanding of the human race, we collectively would be worse off if religion did not exist.
Why do you believe that?

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Re: Faith is not a reliable path to truth

Post by j-c-c » Sat Jul 14, 2018 11:43 am

GRTfast wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 11:31 am
j-c-c wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 11:00 am
I believe with my understanding of the human race, we collectively would be worse off if religion did not exist.
Why do you believe that?
Because many would be jerks seven days a week instead of six?

Seriously, many people are incapable of self control, they need to be lead, they react to fear, cherish a pay off it they follow certain rules, they abhor uncertainty, require an explanation for everything, simplifies complexity on an individual basis,, they seek/need to be surrounded by the like minded, like to know there is hope in the end to correct all their wrong doings if they repent.

Religion meets all these needs, not saying this doesn't foster other undesirable behavior, like the Crusades, etc

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Re: Faith is not a reliable path to truth

Post by exhaustgases » Sat Jul 14, 2018 3:22 pm

Yeah its like the "FAITH" in the global warming religion, they just use a different bible to support their "beliefs".

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Re: Faith is not a reliable path to truth

Post by GRTfast » Sat Jul 14, 2018 4:55 pm

exhaustgases wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 3:22 pm
Yeah its like the "FAITH" in the global warming religion, they just use a different bible to support their "beliefs".
You don’t understand the difference between faith (belief for no good reason) and conclusions supported by science. You demonstrate this over and over.

I dare you to watch the video and try to refute his reasoning without using a logical fallacy.

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Re: Faith is not a reliable path to truth

Post by exhaustgases » Sat Jul 14, 2018 7:17 pm

GRTfast wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 4:55 pm
exhaustgases wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 3:22 pm
Yeah its like the "FAITH" in the global warming religion, they just use a different bible to support their "beliefs".
You don’t understand the difference between faith (belief for no good reason) and conclusions supported by science. You demonstrate this over and over.

I dare you to watch the video and try to refute his reasoning without using a logical fallacy.
You don't either, the proof of a god almighty is proven daily by science yet you don't believe in him? Your pseudoscience of climate change is a collection of well financed fakery. It is no different than anyother devote religious belief. Just because you have absolutely zero depth of mind to see it, doesn't mean it isn't so. You are so into it you can't see past the lies, yeah like any other religion.

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Re: Faith is not a reliable path to truth

Post by GRTfast » Sat Jul 14, 2018 8:01 pm

exhaustgases wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 7:17 pm
GRTfast wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 4:55 pm
exhaustgases wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 3:22 pm
Yeah its like the "FAITH" in the global warming religion, they just use a different bible to support their "beliefs".
You don’t understand the difference between faith (belief for no good reason) and conclusions supported by science. You demonstrate this over and over.

I dare you to watch the video and try to refute his reasoning without using a logical fallacy.
.... the proof of a god almighty is proven daily by science...
Liar.

Please provide the evidence or experiment that proves god exists. It needs to be verifiable and repeatable. Once you’ve done so, go collect your Nobel prize.

I suspect we will be going down the "Emperor's new clothes" path if you choose to respond.
Last edited by GRTfast on Sat Jul 14, 2018 8:56 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: Faith is not a reliable path to truth

Post by GRTfast » Sat Jul 14, 2018 8:54 pm

j-c-c wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 11:43 am
GRTfast wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 11:31 am
j-c-c wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 11:00 am
I believe with my understanding of the human race, we collectively would be worse off if religion did not exist.
Why do you believe that?
Because many would be jerks seven days a week instead of six?

Seriously, many people are incapable of self control, they need to be lead, they react to fear, cherish a pay off it they follow certain rules, they abhor uncertainty, require an explanation for everything, simplifies complexity on an individual basis,, they seek/need to be surrounded by the like minded, like to know there is hope in the end to correct all their wrong doings if they repent.

Religion meets all these needs, not saying this doesn't foster other undesirable behavior, like the Crusades, etc

Based upon that fact that atheists are statistically far less likely to commit crime or cause harm to others, I would submit that people are perfectly capable of behaving reasonably without fear of a deity.

I think it was another thread where I repeated this quote (can't remember where I heard it):

Good people do good, and bad people do bad, but it takes religion for good people to do bad.

Obviously that is an over simplification, but I think it makes my point. I can't see how not believing something until there is sufficient warrant for belief isn't the best, most honest and reasonable position one could have.

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Re: Faith is not a reliable path to truth

Post by lefty o » Sat Jul 14, 2018 8:59 pm

exhaustgases wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 7:17 pm
GRTfast wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 4:55 pm
exhaustgases wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 3:22 pm
Yeah its like the "FAITH" in the global warming religion, they just use a different bible to support their "beliefs".
You don’t understand the difference between faith (belief for no good reason) and conclusions supported by science. You demonstrate this over and over.

I dare you to watch the video and try to refute his reasoning without using a logical fallacy.
You don't either, the proof of a god almighty is proven daily by science yet you don't believe in him? Your pseudoscience of climate change is a collection of well financed fakery. It is no different than anyother devote religious belief. Just because you have absolutely zero depth of mind to see it, doesn't mean it isn't so. You are so into it you can't see past the lies, yeah like any other religion.
now this is pure fantasy bs! :lol:

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Re: Faith is not a reliable path to truth

Post by exhaustgases » Sat Jul 14, 2018 10:07 pm

lefty o wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 8:59 pm
exhaustgases wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 7:17 pm
GRTfast wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 4:55 pm


You don’t understand the difference between faith (belief for no good reason) and conclusions supported by science. You demonstrate this over and over.

I dare you to watch the video and try to refute his reasoning without using a logical fallacy.
You don't either, the proof of a god almighty is proven daily by science yet you don't believe in him? Your pseudoscience of climate change is a collection of well financed fakery. It is no different than anyother devote religious belief. Just because you have absolutely zero depth of mind to see it, doesn't mean it isn't so. You are so into it you can't see past the lies, yeah like any other religion.
now this is pure fantasy bs! :lol:
What is the religion of climate change?

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Re: Faith is not a reliable path to truth

Post by GRTfast » Sat Jul 14, 2018 10:14 pm

exhaustgases wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 10:07 pm
lefty o wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 8:59 pm
exhaustgases wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 7:17 pm


You don't either, the proof of a god almighty is proven daily by science yet you don't believe in him? Your pseudoscience of climate change is a collection of well financed fakery. It is no different than anyother devote religious belief. Just because you have absolutely zero depth of mind to see it, doesn't mean it isn't so. You are so into it you can't see past the lies, yeah like any other religion.
now this is pure fantasy bs! :lol:
What is the religion of climate change?
It’s not a religion, it’s science...and you’re a dishonest idiot.

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Re: Faith is not a reliable path to truth

Post by lefty o » Sat Jul 14, 2018 10:18 pm

exhaustgases wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 10:07 pm
lefty o wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 8:59 pm
exhaustgases wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 7:17 pm


You don't either, the proof of a god almighty is proven daily by science yet you don't believe in him? Your pseudoscience of climate change is a collection of well financed fakery. It is no different than anyother devote religious belief. Just because you have absolutely zero depth of mind to see it, doesn't mean it isn't so. You are so into it you can't see past the lies, yeah like any other religion.
now this is pure fantasy bs! :lol:
What is the religion of climate change?
you mean the made up scare tactic crap from the liberals? thats just as real as whatever religion you practice, made up BS. now if you want to speak of facts, like the earth has gone thru many hot and cold cycles, then lets talk, but the media liberal inspired crap from the likes of al gore, and some of the other nimrods on this forum, is made up hysteria. as far as god being proven daily by science, you have apparently fallen of your chair and hit your head, go seek help.

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Re: Faith is not a reliable path to truth

Post by GRTfast » Sat Jul 14, 2018 10:44 pm

lefty o wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 10:18 pm
exhaustgases wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 10:07 pm
lefty o wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 8:59 pm


now this is pure fantasy bs! :lol:
What is the religion of climate change?
you mean the made up scare tactic crap from the liberals? thats just as real as whatever religion you practice, made up BS. now if you want to speak of facts, like the earth has gone thru many hot and cold cycles, then lets talk, but the media liberal inspired crap from the likes of al gore, and some of the other nimrods on this forum, is made up hysteria. as far as god being proven daily by science, you have apparently fallen of your chair and hit your head, go seek help.
Climate change is not the topic of this thread, it’s assgas’s attempt to derail it. That being said, I’ll grant you the fact that politicians on both sides mischaracterize the science for their own benefit. You are mistaken if you think that it has not been clearly demonstrated to a high degree of certainty that humans are the majority cause for the current (last 50+ years) radically accelerate rate of change. Not recognizing this fact is head in the sand thinking. I’d prefer to have this discussion in another thread if you’d like to present you case for claiming that all the science is made up.

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Re: Faith is not a reliable path to truth

Post by lefty o » Sat Jul 14, 2018 10:52 pm

GRTfast wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 10:44 pm
lefty o wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 10:18 pm
exhaustgases wrote:
Sat Jul 14, 2018 10:07 pm


What is the religion of climate change?
you mean the made up scare tactic crap from the liberals? thats just as real as whatever religion you practice, made up BS. now if you want to speak of facts, like the earth has gone thru many hot and cold cycles, then lets talk, but the media liberal inspired crap from the likes of al gore, and some of the other nimrods on this forum, is made up hysteria. as far as god being proven daily by science, you have apparently fallen of your chair and hit your head, go seek help.
Climate change is not the topic of this thread, it’s assgas’s attempt to derail it. That being said, I’ll grant you the fact that politicians on both sides mischaracterize the science for their own benefit. You are mistaken if you think that it has not been clearly demonstrated to a high degree of certainty that humans are the majority cause for the current (last 50+ years) radically accelerate rate of change. Not recognizing this fact is head in the sand thinking. I’d prefer to have this discussion in another thread if you’d like to present you case for claiming that all the science is made up.
not worth wasting our breath, because i will tell you i disagree with you, and much like religion you wont change my mind.

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