The effects of Trumps new steel and aluminum tariffs on the performance industry.

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pdq67
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Re: The effects of Trumps new steel and aluminum tariffs on the performance industry.

Post by pdq67 » Fri Mar 02, 2018 7:24 pm

Years and years ago when I was with AP Green Refractories, we relined a pair of vertical shaft lime kilns up at Southern MN Beet Sugar CO-OP, Renville, MN.

Well, we got to talking to the Boss about this and that and it was mentioned that they tried to sell their beet sugar pulp to the Japanese for livestock feed!

He said that even though they try to get as much of the sugar out of the pulp as physically possible, the f*8 Japanese spec'd the pulp to contain less sugar than what they were selling so they were shut out of the market.

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Re: The effects of Trumps new steel and aluminum tariffs on the performance industry.

Post by exhaustgases » Fri Mar 02, 2018 9:31 pm

I've experienced the crap metal from china. And I agree they could do the best of the best, the problem is they choose not to. And since employees are not paid or treated well they are the ones that don't care and turn out crap. And some smaller outfits there that only worry about the profits, will cut all the corners that are possible. I'm sure there is no strict paper work requirements for any of their materials, if there is very likely most all of it is rubber stamped for approval. I say study things like the 2007 Toyota engine problems and the many other manufactures with problems in products, you have to ask how many of those units or parts for the units came from china? China knows they will not eat the problems, all that metal comes back to them in a huge scrap shipment on a ship. Its the car or what ever manufacture that eats it, and like mentioned in the forums us consumers eat most of it, in the form of a replacement engine in a car out of warranty.
Last edited by exhaustgases on Fri Mar 02, 2018 9:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The effects of Trumps new steel and aluminum tariffs on the performance industry.

Post by sanfordandson » Fri Mar 02, 2018 9:34 pm

exhaustgases wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 9:31 pm
I've experienced the crap metal from china. And I agree they could do the best of the best, the problem is they choose not to. And since employees are not paid or treated well they are the ones that don't care and turn out crap. And some smaller outfits there that only worry about the profits, will cut all the corners that are possible. I'm sure there is no strict paper work requirements for any of their materials, if there is very likely most all of it is rubber stamped for approval.
Thats what happens we you get rid of regulations.

Trump is no fan of regulations....hmmm...

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Re: The effects of Trumps new steel and aluminum tariffs on the performance industry.

Post by 1989TransAm » Sat Mar 03, 2018 12:05 pm

"In a Pennsylvania Steel Town, Donald Trump’s Tariff Is a Winner"

"President Donald Trump’s proposed tariffs on steel and aluminum imports have many economists and lawmakers worried about a coming trade war. But workers and others in this community, where steel has been made for well over a century, see a chance for more jobs and bigger paychecks.
...
He said workers have had a wage freeze since 2014, and added, “Hopefully better wages and benefits come from this.”"

https://www.wsj.com/articles/in-a-penns ... 1520078400

In this example it is about saving jobs and not having "ghost towns".

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Re: The effects of Trumps new steel and aluminum tariffs on the performance industry.

Post by sanfordandson » Sat Mar 03, 2018 12:22 pm

1989TransAm wrote:
Sat Mar 03, 2018 12:05 pm
"In a Pennsylvania Steel Town, Donald Trump’s Tariff Is a Winner"

"President Donald Trump’s proposed tariffs on steel and aluminum imports have many economists and lawmakers worried about a coming trade war. But workers and others in this community, where steel has been made for well over a century, see a chance for more jobs and bigger paychecks.
...
He said workers have had a wage freeze since 2014, and added, “Hopefully better wages and benefits come from this.”"

https://www.wsj.com/articles/in-a-penns ... 1520078400

In this example it is about saving jobs and not having "ghost towns".
The tariffs will be good for the approx 150K steel and aluminum employees in the US.

They will be bad for all Americans in the way of increased prices.

They will be bad for millions of employees that rely on those metal ranging from aerospace, to automotive, to machinery.

Trip over a dollar to save a penny. Was that in the "art of the deal"?

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Re: The effects of Trumps new steel and aluminum tariffs on the performance industry.

Post by Kenova » Sat Mar 03, 2018 1:43 pm

How much US steel and aluminum is exported, and what happens when it gets slapped with a similar duty by the importing countries?

Ken
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Retaining it is the hard part.

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Re: The effects of Trumps new steel and aluminum tariffs on the performance industry.

Post by dirtracr5 » Sat Mar 03, 2018 2:49 pm

Kenova wrote:
Sat Mar 03, 2018 1:43 pm
How much US steel and aluminum is exported, and what happens when it gets slapped with a similar duty by the importing countries?

Ken
These are the top 10 exports the US had from 2017. These will be the industries hit hardest.


Machinery including computers: US$201.7 billion (13% of total exports)
Electrical machinery, equipment: $174.2 billion (11.3%)
Mineral fuels including oil: $138 billion (8.9%)
Aircraft, spacecraft: $131.2 billion (8.5%)
Vehicles: $130.1 billion (8.4%)
Optical, technical, medical apparatus: $83.6 billion (5.4%)
Plastics, plastic articles: $61.5 billion (4%)
Gems, precious metals: $60.4 billion (3.9%)
Pharmaceuticals: $45.1 billion (2.9%)
Organic chemicals: $36.2 billion (2.3%)

Canada is our biggest importer of Steel and Aluminum. This tariff is hitting the wrong people IMO. China isn't even in the top 10 for steel imports to the US.


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Re: The effects of Trumps new steel and aluminum tariffs on the performance industry.

Post by sanfordandson » Sat Mar 03, 2018 4:53 pm

Firedome8 wrote:
Sat Mar 03, 2018 4:38 pm
https://www.google.com/amp/s/mobile.nyt ... e.amp.html

How do we stop this runaway bus?
Ouch...its getting ugly now!

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Re: The effects of Trumps new steel and aluminum tariffs on the performance industry.

Post by Ratu » Sat Mar 03, 2018 6:31 pm

"I've experienced the crap metal from china. And I agree they could do the best of the best, the problem is they choose not to."

Wrong. US buyers choose cheap crap and they, in turn, stick it to US customers.

Chinese companies supply you according to the specification you write and are prepared to pay for, but as with all things, you get what you pay for.

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Re: The effects of Trumps new steel and aluminum tariffs on the performance industry.

Post by pdq67 » Sat Mar 03, 2018 6:43 pm

Dammit!!

I will say it again!!

Let our TRADE PARTNERS write the trade agreements and us then copy word for word what they wrote, send it back to them and say what they wrote is also ours!

And watch all of them shit a f** brick!

AGAIN!!! Doing this is called

RECIPROCITY!!!


Nobody can bitch because our trade partners got just what they wanted from us AND so did we from them!!

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Re: The effects of Trumps new steel and aluminum tariffs on the performance industry.

Post by Ratu » Sat Mar 03, 2018 6:48 pm

I had to laugh out loud at the notion that tariffs are good for US people. Some really, truly believe in that nonsense. If paying more taxes to your sovereigns is so good, why don't you just go pay more of your money to them? Send a donation cheque to the government. They'll respect you in the morning (not).

And as for the nonsense of protecting some industry or other so the US can go to war with yet another group of people somewhere in the world, haven't there been enough of endless wars to satisfy yet? War injures, maims and kills. It destroys. It doesn't just destroy the places where is is exported to either. It comes home. It destroys the homeland, then the culture and then the people. Just look around you...

In this instance President Trump has demonstrated that his grasp of economics is poor. He has taken on bad advice and acted on it. He has hurt the very people who he claimed to want to be helping. Tariffs are a bad mistake which will have ramifications.

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Re: The effects of Trumps new steel and aluminum tariffs on the performance industry.

Post by dirtracr5 » Sat Mar 03, 2018 7:03 pm

Ratu wrote:
Sat Mar 03, 2018 6:48 pm
I had to laugh out loud at the notion that tariffs are good for US people. Some really, truly believe in that nonsense. If paying more taxes to your sovereigns is so good, why don't you just go pay more of your money to them? Send a donation cheque to the government. They'll respect you in the morning (not).

And as for the nonsense of protecting some industry or other so the US can go to war with yet another group of people somewhere in the world, haven't there been enough of endless wars to satisfy yet? War injures, maims and kills. It destroys. It doesn't just destroy the places where is is exported to either. It comes home. It destroys the homeland, then the culture and then the people. Just look around you...

In this instance President Trump has demonstrated that his grasp of economics is poor. He has taken on bad advice and acted on it. He has hurt the very people who he claimed to want to be helping. Tariffs are a bad mistake which will have ramifications.
I agree. Well said.

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Re: The effects of Trumps new steel and aluminum tariffs on the performance industry.

Post by pdq67 » Sat Mar 03, 2018 7:32 pm

I pray that Pres. Trump will have GOOD people helping him do the job of President of our Country.

One man can not know everything so he needs good experts around him that he/WE can trust to do the right things for the good of EVERYBODY!

Not f**, "Carpet Beggars"!

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Re: The effects of Trumps new steel and aluminum tariffs on the performance industry.

Post by woody b » Sat Mar 03, 2018 7:33 pm

I haven't looked into the new tariffs, but is a tariff what's really needed to bring these jobs, and industries back? There's 3 problems facing these, and other industries in the US.

1. The EPA. I believe some regulations are needed, but when is it too much. It's really hard to find a car battery made in the USA now.(not steel, or aluminum, but seems like a good comparison) I believe part of this is caused by lead, and the EPA.

2. OSHA. Once again, some regulations are needed. I believe many OSHA regs are overboard.


3. Workers, willing to work. Too many people want the CEO's pay, with the low skilled job. Entry level, low skilled jobs often go unfilled because people don't want to work for what these jobs should pay. This won't change as long as people can live off of Government benefits. (I'm not talking about Social Security, or even SS disability)
I used to be a people person, but people ruined it.

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