California may ban combustion engines!

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F-BIRD'88
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Re: California may ban combustion engines!

Post by F-BIRD'88 » Tue Sep 26, 2017 2:10 pm

I can't stand the thought of them in a vette or Camaro or Porsche or Ferrari...

If GM offered a Electric drivetrain in a Corvette I'd be first in line to buy one.
It would be a long line up too.

The only real problem with electric cars is there is not enough of them YET.

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Re: California may ban combustion engines!

Post by Steve.k » Tue Sep 26, 2017 2:13 pm

I beleive we will be electric sooner than later. However has anyone decided what to do with the toxic batteries and electronic components and the end of the cars cylce? What is green California going to to with mtns of dead batteries in there wrecking yards. Plus will wind turbines charge them all up? Just talked with a bmw owner who had their electric buzz box. Gets 115km or 75 miles to charge. Not to far in my books.just did a 5000km trip in my 07 shelby. Got average of 21mpg and it has been chipped well over 500hp. I do not think the mfgs have hit the upper limits of fuel economy yet but if squeezed more it will be interesting to see how high they get.

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Re: California may ban combustion engines!

Post by statsystems » Tue Sep 26, 2017 2:18 pm

Cougar5.0 wrote:Could do without the name-calling that inevitably rears it's ugly head in what I think is an interesting topic.

I won't deny that I'm glad I don't live in CA, but it's inevitable that electric (or possibly some other technology like fuel cell/electric) will become a major portion of the commuter car market within the next 10-20 years. Affordable cars will eventually be faster than IC powered cars, with face flattening torque, could be interesting...
This sounds like all the stuff we heard in the 50's, 60's and 70's about all the great technology.

I won't hold my breath I will live long enough to see anything battery powered work anywhere besides a miserable big city, where I will never live.

God forbid should you need to haul something with battery power.

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Re: California may ban combustion engines!

Post by Cougar5.0 » Tue Sep 26, 2017 2:37 pm

statsystems wrote:
Cougar5.0 wrote:Could do without the name-calling that inevitably rears it's ugly head in what I think is an interesting topic.

I won't deny that I'm glad I don't live in CA, but it's inevitable that electric (or possibly some other technology like fuel cell/electric) will become a major portion of the commuter car market within the next 10-20 years. Affordable cars will eventually be faster than IC powered cars, with face flattening torque, could be interesting...
This sounds like all the stuff we heard in the 50's, 60's and 70's about all the great technology.

I won't hold my breath I will live long enough to see anything battery powered work anywhere besides a miserable big city, where I will never live.

God forbid should you need to haul something with battery power.
I'm not touting the emerging technology, just interested in it and understand it's inevitability. I may not live long enough to see it mature, doesn't mean I'm gonna grumpy old man shake my fist at it either.

The Tesla Model X can tow 3500 lb, 5000lb with a smaller rear wheel. A test showed it retained 70% of it's 250 mile range while towing a 2300 lb. trailer. https://electrek.co/2016/08/29/tesla-mo ... tric-boat/

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Re: California may ban combustion engines!

Post by MikeD » Tue Sep 26, 2017 2:50 pm

I think its inevitable but it doesn't mean I have to like it...

Regarding sports cars having electric powertrains; have you ever watched a Formula E race? Absolute silence. All you here is gear whine and screeching tires. Like I said; no soul. In fact look at the grandstands. Empty. And hybrid electrics are in my view heavy, over complicated and expensive. Your in effect paying for two powertrains in one vehicle. These are the very issues they face in F1.

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Re: California may ban combustion engines!

Post by Cougar5.0 » Tue Sep 26, 2017 2:56 pm

I agree - the sound part is the worst - even fake sound is better than just gear whine and tire scrubbing.

Funny, as I thought about the sound, I realized that nearly 100% of people in this country "drove" an electric "vehicle" as the first self-powered vehicle they ever had the wheel to (think about it.) :wink:

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Re: California may ban combustion engines!

Post by Truckedup » Tue Sep 26, 2017 3:34 pm

From an electricial power viewpoint, the Tesla website says a 50 amp 240 volt circuit to charge the batteries. It can take two hours....I believe the actual load is about 40 amps.....That's a bit more than a typical residential AC load....So along comes a heat wave with the AC load causing potential brown outs...Then comes the recharging of the electric vehicles on top of that...I was an electrical contractor doing large jobs and the electrical distribution system is spotty in many areas.....
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Re: California may ban combustion engines!

Post by Zmechanic » Tue Sep 26, 2017 3:39 pm

MikeD wrote: And is there enough Lithium in the world to power all these things? The batteries are not recyclable. What happens to the waste once they are done? Too many unanswered questions...
While your question of lithium supply is truly a hurdle, the batteries are most certainly recyclable. I don't know where you got that..

The "baby with the bathwater" approach of throwing your hands up and saying there are too many unknowns isn't going to stop a thing. You or I might not have the answers, but while there's money to had, you can bet someone will find them.

I get the nostalgia of the ICE. Nothing compares to the intricacies of the engine as it has currently evolved, or even the sound/experience of one. But if that was the only criteria for keeping something around, the world would be very different place.

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Re: California may ban combustion engines!

Post by bigblockmopar » Tue Sep 26, 2017 3:51 pm

First off, the ban is about new cars being sold.
Car companies are simply forced to start mass producing electric passenger cars.
It says nothing yet about 'specialty' vehicles like big trucks, bikes or farm vehicles just to name some.

Also, the current stash of cars on the road will still be running around for another 10-20-30-40 more years, unless they will be taxed to shittereens with anti-pollution laws. At which they will be dumped in countries who don't care for this.

How would say, Mexico deal with this?
Can't see an entire electrical grid being made in a few years.

Also imagine what all this will do to the price of price of gasoline as most stuff on the road becomes 'electric'.

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Re: California may ban combustion engines!

Post by stevy » Tue Sep 26, 2017 3:57 pm

F-BIRD'88 wrote:I can't stand the thought of them in a vette or Camaro or Porsche or Ferrari...

If GM offered a Electric drivetrain in a Corvette I'd be first in line to buy one.
It would be a long line up too.
Wow. Why the !@#$ are you on here ??? Seriously. Take your pro-electric crap elsewhere.

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Re: California may ban combustion engines!

Post by Steve.k » Tue Sep 26, 2017 4:09 pm

Realistically this likely has more to do with keeping silicon valley their cash cow.There are parts of California that no way in hell electric will work.

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Re: California may ban combustion engines!

Post by MikeD » Tue Sep 26, 2017 4:47 pm

My personal feeling about "sports" cars like a Ferrari or Porsche being hybrid is that its completely unnecessary. Again too heavy and too complicated. More of a showcase of "see what I can do". I don't think emissions require hybrid to be widespread at least not at this point. And most of the people buying Porsche 918's and Ferrari La Ferrari's are posers anyway...

Just look at what Porsche has done. All 911's are turbo's for god's sake. Brands are being water down. Then again they announced that the 911R is so popular (no Turbo and a manual transmission) that maybe some sense will come into these corporate heads....

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Re: California may ban combustion engines!

Post by Cougar5.0 » Tue Sep 26, 2017 4:57 pm

Someone wants these things, the Tesla Model 3 has a pre-sales orders (reservations) for a half-million vehicles.

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Re: California may ban combustion engines!

Post by BOOT » Tue Sep 26, 2017 5:19 pm

Didn't read all the comments so if someone already brought it up, oops. Would suck to drive into cali after the ban, I'm sure gas stations will become more scarce, well not as much for diesel cause of out of state trucks. I wonder how electric flatbeds will work out? I'm sure emergency services would still be dino fuel and any commercial use would just need a really pricey permit. Bet there would be a black-market, at least for boats, RV's n such. They gonna shut down the airports LOL!

I hope they succeed.

edit: remind me to buy stock in steam train engines LOL
Last edited by BOOT on Tue Sep 26, 2017 5:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: California may ban combustion engines!

Post by F-BIRD'88 » Tue Sep 26, 2017 5:20 pm

stevy wrote:
F-BIRD'88 wrote:I can't stand the thought of them in a vette or Camaro or Porsche or Ferrari...

If GM offered a Electric drivetrain in a Corvette I'd be first in line to buy one.
It would be a long line up too.
Wow. Why the !@#$ are you on here ??? Seriously. Take your pro-electric crap elsewhere.
I don't need your approval.

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