2017 Engine Masters ???

Open

Moderator: Team

Post Reply
Walter R. Malik
Guru
Guru
Posts: 3347
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2012 11:15 am
Location: Roseville, Michigan (just north of Detroit)
Contact:

Re: 2017 Engine Masters ???

Post by Walter R. Malik » Sat Sep 23, 2017 1:21 pm

Walter R. Malik wrote:

My CNC guy dropped the ball so, I will be spending the weekend hand porting a pair of cast iron Plymouth POLY heads.
I can't imagine I will have the time to make them as good as the "model" port but, you gotta do what you gotta do.
At least I already have the valves.
Because of the issues with the CNC shop I normally use, the heads for my "B" engine Mopar are not finished either so, Daniel Bosheasrs lent me the heads off his last years contest engine.
http://www.rmcompetition.com
Specialty engine building at its finest.

Barry_R
Guru
Guru
Posts: 1194
Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2006 8:57 pm
Location: Detroit area
Contact:

Re: 2017 Engine Masters ???

Post by Barry_R » Tue Sep 26, 2017 6:29 am

Well - it runs...
Did cam break in last night.
More to follow - I hope...
Survival Motorsports
www.survivalmotorsports.com

WD for Comp, Manley, Blue Thunder, Diamond
Probe, Holley, Clevite, Federal-Mogul, Scat....

Walter R. Malik
Guru
Guru
Posts: 3347
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2012 11:15 am
Location: Roseville, Michigan (just north of Detroit)
Contact:

Re: 2017 Engine Masters ???

Post by Walter R. Malik » Tue Sep 26, 2017 9:41 am

Barry_R wrote:Well - it runs...
Did cam break in last night.
More to follow - I hope...
Great Barry ... I fear that with this "B" engine, I will be running it for the first time, and therefore breaking-in the cam & lifters with full valve spring pressures, at the contest.
It is supposed to be the very first engine to run Monday morning.
http://www.rmcompetition.com
Specialty engine building at its finest.

Ted
New Member
New Member
Posts: 49
Joined: Fri Jul 03, 2009 3:04 pm
Location: Central Texas
Contact:

Re: 2017 Engine Masters ???

Post by Ted » Wed Sep 27, 2017 9:57 pm

The Eaton Balancing entry will not make it for its running in the Monday Vintage engine class. I'll be calling Randy in the morning so that the Monday run schedule can be adjusted. The MEL engine that I working on has a serious cam/lifter wear issue. The increase in lash was first noticed after cam run in. The actual lift at the valves was checked at that point and the numbers pretty indicated no lobe wear issue at that point.

Checking the lash again after a short pull (3500-5000 rpms)for an ignition timing check pull saw another increase in lash on all lobes. Until I tear it down, I'll not know if it's the lifters or the camshaft that contributed to the failure. Looking in the small oil holes in the valley at the camshaft, the cam lobes do not appear to be bad but all sixteen lifters fail to come up out of their bores as they are mushroomed on their bottoms. Gut fee at this point says it's the lifters. Needless to say, I only had that one camshaft and no backups. Come tomorrow morning, I'll be pulling the camshaft and lifters for a more detailed examination.

Only made one pull with the MEL but it was making 692 lbs/ft torque at 4000 rpms and the HP at 5000 was 619. Spark plugs indicated that the total timing being set at 36° was still too much and the fuel mixture was on the rich side. Never got a chance to make another pull with a reduction in timing as that was when the valve lash was checked and found to be excessive.

I'll post more on this once I know more. Ted Eaton.
Ted Eaton

Barry_R
Guru
Guru
Posts: 1194
Joined: Wed Jan 18, 2006 8:57 pm
Location: Detroit area
Contact:

Re: 2017 Engine Masters ???

Post by Barry_R » Thu Sep 28, 2017 6:21 am

Fighting my way though problems here too

First cam showed excessive lash after 11 pulls.
Spent yesterday mopping things up and reassembling with another cam.
Will be doing break in on that one this morning.
Survival Motorsports
www.survivalmotorsports.com

WD for Comp, Manley, Blue Thunder, Diamond
Probe, Holley, Clevite, Federal-Mogul, Scat....

perfcrank
New Member
New Member
Posts: 14
Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2014 8:03 am

Re: 2017 Engine Masters ???

Post by perfcrank » Thu Sep 28, 2017 8:01 pm

Ted your cam bearings are giving up the ghost happened first year I did the big block Chevy had to upgrade to race bearings.

JonKaase
Pro
Pro
Posts: 250
Joined: Mon Nov 20, 2006 8:24 pm

Re: 2017 Engine Masters ???

Post by JonKaase » Thu Sep 28, 2017 9:03 pm

I dropped mine off at the school today while on the way to my Dad's 95th birthday weekend. No other engines there yet. Kaase

JonKaase
Pro
Pro
Posts: 250
Joined: Mon Nov 20, 2006 8:24 pm

Re: 2017 Engine Masters ???

Post by JonKaase » Thu Sep 28, 2017 9:07 pm

Ted, does Royce have anything you could use? Maybe you could run on Wed, I don't think anyone cares about the run order

Ted
New Member
New Member
Posts: 49
Joined: Fri Jul 03, 2009 3:04 pm
Location: Central Texas
Contact:

Re: 2017 Engine Masters ???

Post by Ted » Fri Sep 29, 2017 11:24 am

As per my post above, the MEL engine I was going to compete with had a serious lifter failure. All sixteen lifters are wiped out and mushroomed to the point that I had to remove them from the bottoms of the lifter bores. The cam bearings as well as the other bearings in the engine look excellent as it appears the oil filter managed to catch all the trash. Haven't looked at the oil pump yet but suspect it has some scoring on the rotors. There's plenty of lifter trash in the oil pan. The piston skirts also took a beating as the lifter debris hit them and did some serious scoring. Pistons skirts have metal impregnated on them so they would take some serious cleaning if so inclined to use them just to get the engine up and running in a timely manner. A larger piece of lifter debris actually got caught between the piston and the wall and did some serious galling on that particular piston. Could be cleaned up if in a bind but I'm not going to go there with so little time to get everything back together again.

Surprisingly the camshaft itself came through looking a lot better than I thought it would. Lobes exhibit some scoring and wear marks but no serious wiping off of metal. At this point, I suspect the cam core that was used is chilled iron rather than flame hardened. I'll know more on that after getting a Rockwell Hardness test performed on the various parts later today. I can salvage the camshaft again by just sending it back to the grinder and having it reground abeit on a slightly smaller base circle. Doesn't look like it will take much.

I've no spare shell lifters that I feel confident in using which is what the valve train is currently setup for. I was offered some Shubeck lifters to get the engine back up and running but that would require some shorter pushrods than what I have already. And it would take a day to get those lifters here.

Considering it's a two day trip to get to Lima, I'm simply out of time so I'm not going to make any serious effort in piecing the engine back together until I have all the right pieces again to do it right. Depending upon the rule changes for next years' EMC, I've got a year to work the kinks out of this particular engine and also work on a backup engine at the same time. Ted Eaton.
Ted Eaton

SMITHBERGRACING
Guru
Guru
Posts: 1065
Joined: Sun Jul 22, 2007 6:11 pm
Location: NEBRASKA
Contact:

Re: 2017 Engine Masters ???

Post by SMITHBERGRACING » Fri Sep 29, 2017 1:01 pm

Sorry to hear Ted Eaton. :(

Walter R. Malik
Guru
Guru
Posts: 3347
Joined: Tue Jul 24, 2012 11:15 am
Location: Roseville, Michigan (just north of Detroit)
Contact:

Re: 2017 Engine Masters ???

Post by Walter R. Malik » Fri Sep 29, 2017 7:33 pm

I just buttoned-up my "B" engine Mopar with Daniel's heads on it. All it needs now is plug wires which I'll get tomorrow .

My Plymouth Poly is coming along. Gross looking, non matching ported intake ports and no porting on the exhausts but, it should run fine ... just not make much power. :cry:

Both will be making their maiden "start-up" on the contest dyno. :roll: 35 whole minutes each to tune 'em up.
http://www.rmcompetition.com
Specialty engine building at its finest.

Adger Smith
Guru
Guru
Posts: 2135
Joined: Sun Jul 25, 2004 7:35 pm
Location: Texarkana, Ar-Tx

Re: 2017 Engine Masters ???

Post by Adger Smith » Fri Sep 29, 2017 9:03 pm

We have had 2 drop out. Kustom Kemps is out as well as Ted Eaton.
Keep an eye on Speed Talk
The schedule is going to be posted with the run order adjusted.
It is too late to get it on the Hot rod site so I will use speed Talk.
Adger Smith
Adger Smith Performance Engines
903 794 7223 shop
903 824 4924 cell
adgersperf@aol.com e-mail

kid7755
Pro
Pro
Posts: 250
Joined: Wed Dec 12, 2012 4:17 pm

Re: 2017 Engine Masters ???

Post by kid7755 » Fri Sep 29, 2017 9:35 pm

Man I'm sorry to hear that guys.
I do really miss the pain and suffering. I'd be dynoing today normally. I have last year's junk on my test stand so in the name of EMC I rattled the neighborhood a bit.

Good luck to all!

Henderson

Adger Smith
Guru
Guru
Posts: 2135
Joined: Sun Jul 25, 2004 7:35 pm
Location: Texarkana, Ar-Tx

Re: 2017 Engine Masters ???

Post by Adger Smith » Fri Sep 29, 2017 10:35 pm

This is the revised run order for EMC 2017
Please note the team numbers have not changed,
but the order that you run as well as the day may have changed
Sorry to add to anyone's level of frustration, but this is due to drop outs
and the need to meet the tight schedule
Adger Smith

Monday 10/2/17
Team #
Run Dyno
Order Cell Team Name Class Team Leader
11 1 1 RM Competition Traditional Muscle Randy Malik
14 2 2 Yestertech Vintage Jerry Christenson
13 3 1 Performance Crankshaft Traditional Muscle Adney Brown
16 4 2 Gene Adams Performance/Smithberg Racing Vintage Steve White
15 5 1 Creason Racing Engines Traditional Muscle Rick Ferbert
Tuesday 10/3/17
Team # Run Order Dyno Cell Team Name Class Team Leader
18 6 2 Kaase - Brechler Vintage Jon Kaase
17 7 1 WCH Racing Engines Traditional Muscle Jammie Wells
20 8 2 RB Vintage Engines Vintage Royce Brechler
19 9 1 Semco Performance Traditional Muscle Michael Semchee
22 10 2 Griffin Motorsports Vintage Joe Griffin
21 11 1 Ray's Dyno & Machine Traditional Muscle Ray Clayton
Wednesday 10/4/17
Team # Run Order Dyno Cell Team Name Class Team Leader
24 12 2 Performance Carburetion Vintage Randy Malik
23 13 1 BES Racing Engines Traditional Muscle Tony Bischoff
25 14 2 Jim's Tooling Solutions (Grace/Dugan) Traditional Muscle Jim Schmitz
27 15 1 Total Performance Traditional Muscle Randy Malik
28 16 2 Survival Motorsports Traditional Muscle Barry
Thursday 10/5/17
Team # Run Order Dyno Cell Team Name Class Team Leader
29 17 1 Czar Racing Traditional Muscle Christopher Pelczar
30 18 2 Red Rocket Engine Company Traditional Muscle Daniel Boshears
31 19 1 LRE Traditional Muscle Johan Lindstrom
32 20 2 Sinclair Community College HP Traditional Muscle Blaine Heeter
EMC Staff/Management reserves the right to alter the run order as required for the flow to meet the time restraints of the event.
Adger Smith
Adger Smith Performance Engines
903 794 7223 shop
903 824 4924 cell
adgersperf@aol.com e-mail

Adger Smith
Guru
Guru
Posts: 2135
Joined: Sun Jul 25, 2004 7:35 pm
Location: Texarkana, Ar-Tx

Re: 2017 Engine Masters ???

Post by Adger Smith » Fri Sep 29, 2017 10:36 pm

2017 EMC Run Order2.docx
(16.95 KiB) Downloaded 21 times
Adger Smith
Adger Smith Performance Engines
903 794 7223 shop
903 824 4924 cell
adgersperf@aol.com e-mail

Post Reply