Chinese look a like Little-M block

grudge racer · Post by **grudge racer** » Fri Sep 04, 2009 7:39 pm

sorry about that rant guys because this aint the bullet.

nich · Post by **nich** » Sat Sep 05, 2009 10:35 pm

Just got a PBM block in on Friday that a customer wants to use. I believe we have a hardness tester at work. If we do I'll check our block and post back here. I gave the block a quick look over and it looked like they cnc'd the PBM logo over the top of what might be the original serial number which is on the starter pad. Then they cnc'd the PBM serial number on the deck surface where it normally is. Suspicious to say the least. has anyone else seen this?

nich

CNC BLOCKS · Post by **CNC BLOCKS** » Sun Sep 06, 2009 9:05 am

nich wrote:Just got a PBM block in on Friday that a customer wants to use. I believe we have a hardness tester at work. If we do I'll check our block and post back here. I gave the block a quick look over and it looked like they cnc'd the PBM logo over the top of what might be the original serial number which is on the starter pad. Then they cnc'd the PBM serial number on the deck surface where it normally is. Suspicious to say the least. has anyone else seen this?

nich

I Don't know as we have never seen a PBM block yet check the cam tunnel and make sure its 2.000

nich · Post by **nich** » Sun Sep 06, 2009 9:11 am

I just went back to the first page and looked at Carl's pictures. I must say the procomp block looks AWFULY similar to the PBM at our shop. I'll try to get some pictures of our block and post them here for comparison. I won't be back at work until Tuesday though.

Carl, does your procomp block have a serial number on the starter pad?

nich

CNC BLOCKS · Post by **CNC BLOCKS** » Sun Sep 06, 2009 10:44 am

nich wrote:I just went back to the first page and looked at Carl's pictures. I must say the procomp block looks AWFULY similar to the PBM at our shop. I'll try to get some pictures of our block and post them here for comparison. I won't be back at work until Tuesday though.

Carl, does your procomp block have a serial number on the starter pad?

nich

I believe there is a mumber etched into the casting in that area, On those blocks make sure the hole that goes through the lifter bores front to rear are at the correct height as the block I have here they look 3/16 lower then the Dart or OEM blocks.

lun40119 · Post by **lun40119** » Sun Sep 06, 2009 12:40 pm

I can understand wanting to be pissed at the messenger, but in reality, it is guys like Carl that keep the rest of us, that don't have the means to check all of this, informed. I have talked to Carl quite a few times and I believe that he doesn't post any of this stuff to start pissing matches. He genuinely just wants to inform the masses. So when I see people trying to stir BS, or cause trouble it is irritating. Im sure that Carl will post the facts when he gets around to it............remember guy is trying to run a business.

Thanks for all the help, and great information, Carl. Don't let a couple of DB's wreck it for the rest of us!!!!!!!

1989TransAm · Post by **1989TransAm** » Sun Sep 06, 2009 4:09 pm

"Carl. Don't let a couple of DB's wreck it for the rest of us!!!!!!!"

I agree. Carl has been around the block a number of times so I don't think it will bother him at all.

k-star · Post by **k-star** » Sun Sep 06, 2009 7:42 pm

1989TransAm wrote:"Carl. Don't let a couple of DB's wreck it for the rest of us!!!!!!!"

I agree. Carl has been around the block a number of times so I don't think it will bother him at all.

Yea, Carl is on the Yellow Bullet also, this place is grade school for him..L.O.L.

Keith

needforspeed66gt · Post by **needforspeed66gt** » Sun Sep 06, 2009 7:52 pm

1989TransAm wrote:Carl has been around the block a number of times

No pun intended right

Hammer · Post by **Hammer** » Sun Sep 06, 2009 9:24 pm

lun40119 wrote:I can understand wanting to be pissed at the messenger, but in reality, it is guys like Carl that keep the rest of us, that don't have the means to check all of this, informed. I have talked to Carl quite a few times and I believe that he doesn't post any of this stuff to start pissing matches. He genuinely just wants to inform the masses. So when I see people trying to stir BS, or cause trouble it is irritating. Im sure that Carl will post the facts when he gets around to it............remember guy is trying to run a business.

Thanks for all the help, and great information, Carl. Don't let a couple of DB's wreck it for the rest of us!!!!!!!

agreed 100% hopefully save me some cash down the road. thanks Carl and others that share there findings.

ProPower engines · Post by **ProPower engines** » Mon Sep 07, 2009 9:06 pm

Has anyone seen the ad on ebay for a NEW SBC cast iron Bowtie block by UNIBORE
I only see 2 block plugs on this block.
4.080 bore/2.450 mains

Unkl Ian · Post by **Unkl Ian** » Mon Sep 07, 2009 9:26 pm

ProPower engines wrote:Has anyone seen the ad on ebay for a NEW SBC cast iron Bowtie block by UNIBORE

No idea, but here is the link:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NEW-SBC- ... arQ5fParts

Willie · Post by **Willie** » Mon Sep 07, 2009 10:20 pm

I know the guy that has this block he buys alot of used and unused nascar stuff his shop is about 15 miles from mine...

CNC BLOCKS · Post by **CNC BLOCKS** » Tue Sep 08, 2009 8:21 am

ProPower engines wrote:Has anyone seen the ad on ebay for a NEW SBC cast iron Bowtie block by UNIBORE
I only see 2 block plugs on this block.
4.080 bore/2.450 mains

Unibore has machined blocks for GM for years there is no P/N on that block so becareful as that could be a short deck block.

CNC BLOCKS · Post by **CNC BLOCKS** » Wed Sep 09, 2009 5:49 am

Finally did the final probling of the Brand X block

Block datum points in the CNC machine are the cam and crank center line, center line of the bar through the mains and the center of the head dowel on the front of the drivers side block.

Also the block uses the same dowel holes under the fuel pump and starter area which I would say means the blocks are being machined on a track system which is used in high production machining.

One of the biggest problems with the block is from the center of the dowel pin which is the datum point, From there out to the front of the block the demension is suppose to be .845 and on this block its .865 which will move the cam a head in the block .020 and on a flat tappet cam the lobe will not last long riding on the edge of the lobe.

Now if you are using a BHJ lifter bore fixture which referances of the front of the block and going to an lifter .875 lifter bore it will leave a shadow on the rear of each lifter bore which means every lifter bore will need to be bushed even to run a .875 lifter.

The cylinders on the both sides were with in .003 front to rear.

On the even side left to right or intake to exhaust or I call this Y-axis the best was .001 worst was .0038

On the odd side in Y-axis best was .0018 the worst was .0077

Deck heights were on the even side were
low was 9.028
High was 9.038

Deck heights on the odd side were
Low was 9.029
High was 9.032

On the lifter bores we check the angles on all four corners only which should be 41 degrees.

Front lifter bore cylinder one was 40.937
Rear on cylinder seven was 41.026

Front lifter bore cylinder two was 41.020
Rear on cylinder eight was 41.014

I also used a .8425 cutter and machined down appox. .200 down on all four corners

And on cylinder one first lifter bore the cutter cut appox.006 at about 8 O'clock looking from the left side of the block which means the lifter bore was to far back and to far to the inside of the block

On cylinder 7 the rear lifter bore cut only at 12 O'clock looking from the left side of the block meaning the lifter bore was to far to the out side of the block appox. .006

On cylinder number 2 front lifter bore and cylinder number 8 rear lifter bore the cutter was only cutting at 12 O'Clock looking from the left side of the block which means the lifter bore was towards the inside of the block to much appox. .004

Running a roller cam your are dealing with direct center lines and having lifter bores of that far will change your seat to seat timing events.

The other problem I mentioned earlier was the hole through the lifter bore front to rear to and on the front lifter bore even side was the with in .003 of the Dart block but the rear of the hole dropped .0024

Looking at the 2 blocks side by side the hole in the Brand X block looks like the oil hole is 3/16 closer to the bottom of the lifter bore compared to the Dart blocks, The problem being is there is not enough material under the bottom side of the lifter bore or cam tunnel area as I measured from the cam bearing journal to the casting and its .200 different then the Dart block. Which means there maybe a chance of the lifters oil band being exposed when the lifter is on the base cirlce of the cam and more so a bigger problem with a small base circle camshaft.

From here the block is going to an other shop to have a brennel test done.

At this piont I am not going to waste my time check the cam tunnel for its locations as I have spent to much time all ready.

From my findings this block needs a lot of work before it could be used and if its a soft as I think it is there is no cure for that.