CAR CRAFT STREET RACE RULES 2005..... Odd Head Rules

SStrokerAce · Post by **SStrokerAce** » Fri Mar 18, 2005 11:53 pm

Just looking thru this and it always amazes me to look at rules for a new class.

http://www.fasteststreetcar.com/2005/ru ... trace.html

The one that I think is really odd is this....

1.17d) HEADS, PORTING: Permitted on intake, combustion chamber, & exhaust port areas only. Welding, epoxy, etc. is strictly prohibited. Small block intake port runner may not measure larger than 221.0 cc, as installed on vehicle (whether ported or as-cast). Having an small-block intake port runner larger than 221.0 cc will result in disqualification. Big block (except Chrysler) intake port runner may not measure larger than 306.0 cc, as installed on vehicle (whether ported or as-cast). Chrysler Big block intake port runner may not measure larger than 276.0 cc, as installed on vehicle (whether ported or as-cast).

Here is the accepted list of heads for the class:

1.17l) ALLOWED CYLINDER HEAD LIST: The following cylinder heads are the only accepted versions for the Street class.
Small Block Ford – Standard Intake Runner & Exhaust Port Versions Only
• Ford OEM 4.6L 2-valve & 4-valve, 5.0, 5.8 Cast Iron and Aluminum Heads
• FRPP GT-40/GT-40P/GT-40X, GT-40Y Cast Iron and Aluminum Heads
• FRPP “Z” Cylinder Head PN# M-6049-Z304
• Edelbrock Performer & Performer RPM
• Edelbrock Victor Jr. (20-Degree Versions Only)
• Trick Flow Twisted Wedge & Track Heat, (Non-R)
• Brodix ST 5.0 Aluminum, PN# ST 5.0, ST 5.0R
• Brodix TI & T1X
• Holley 5.0, PN# 300-573, 574, 575, 576, 577, 578, 579
• World Products Roush 180 & Windsor Jr., PN# 53030, 23030
• World Products Roush 200 & Windsor Sr., PN# 53040
• Dart Pro 1 170cc & 195cc as-cast; 215cc CNC
• Air Flow Research 165, 185, 205
• Canfield 20 Degree 197 cc, PN# 20-450, 20-475

Small Block Chevrolet – Standard Intake Runner & Exhaust Port Versions Only
• GM & Chevrolet Factory Small Block Heads, including LS1, LT4, etc.
• Edelbrock Performer, Performer RPM, E-Tec 170cc & 200cc
• Edelbrock Victor Jr., 23 Degree, Standard Runner & Exhaust Port Only
• Air Flow Research 180, 190, 195, 210, 220 bare castings – Standard Runner & Exhaust Port Only
• Brodix RR 180, RR200, -8 & -10 Standard, – Standard Runner & Exhaust Port Only
• Dart Iron Eagle 165cc through 215cc – Standard Runner & Exhaust Port Only
• Dart Pro 1 200 through 215cc - Standard Runner & Exhaust Port Only
• Canfield 23-500 – 23 Degree, 23-600 (220cc) - Standard Runner & Exhaust Port Only
• Trick Flow – 215cc R-Series & Duttweiller 23-degree - Standard Runner & Exhaust Port
• World Products S/R Torquer, Sportsman II 200 cc
• World Products Motown 205 cc, 220 cc - Standard Runner & Exhaust Port

Chrysler Small Block – Standard Intake Runner & Exhaust Port Versions Only
• Stock factory OEM iron or OEM aluminum 318/340/360 Cylinder Heads
• Edelbrock Performer RPM & RPM 340
• Brodix B1-BA (not MC)
• Mopar Performance W2
• Indy 360-2 Oval Port Only (not 360-1 Rectangular Port)

AMC Small Block
• Edelbrock Performance RPM
• AMC Factory OEM Iron & OEM Aluminum

Big Block Chevrolet – Oval Port Only
• GM Stock Factory Oval Port
• Edelbrock 454 Oval Port #60459
• AFR 265 & 290cc Oval Port
• Brodix BB-1O, BB-1, RR294-Oval

Big Block Ford
• Stock Factory OEM 460 big block
• Edelbrock Performer 460 RPM #60669, 60679
• FRPP Cobra Jet & Super Cobra Jet

Big Block Oldsmobile
• Stock Factory OEM big block
• Edelbrock Performer RPM Olds

Big Block Pontiac
• Stock Factory OEM big block
• Edelbrock Pontiac Performer & RPM

Big Block Chrysler – 276.00 cc Maximum
• Stock Factory OEM big block
• Edelbrock Performer RPM 440
• Indy 440-SR, 440-EZ only (not EZ-1)
• Brodix B1-BS
• Mopar Stage 5, Stage 6

Now I can understand rules in NHRA and IHRA that give you a limit based on the original head castings but a arbitary 221cc seems odd. Wouldn't this favor the heads with the shortest centerline lengths? Plus you have the addition of turbos, blowers and Nitrous in the mix here, so port sizes will really be a limiting factor on some motors and not even come close on others like a Pontiac.

I highlighted heads that stick out in that group. These seem to be the heads to go with in this class. The big blocks all limited to NA and N2O applications only and the small block allows turbos and blowers up to 360 cubes.

What would you guys run for a motor combination in this class given these rules?

I was thinking a BBC with Oval Port BB-1's al la the DIRT Modifieds with a N2O shot. It's 3600lbs you have to move but 900-1000hp should be doable there.

Bret

Post by **ClassKing** » Sun Mar 20, 2005 12:33 am

I think the people making up these rules are blindfolded and throwing darts at a "rule-board" Whatever gets hit is a new rule. There is no such thing as a big block or small block Pontiac. There's only one block. So it must be determined by c.i. - so...now what?

It's like the Engine Masters contest - it was NEVER for the guy in his garage screwing together an engine like they hyped. You could see that from the start. It was obvious that the only people that could win would at a minimum own their own dyno.

So let's make up some weird rules, watch people spend mega dollars, and go race. What's the winner get with this CC deal? A jacket and some ink?
blah.

ChrisU · Post by **ChrisU** » Sun Mar 20, 2005 8:47 am

I totaly agree with you but -

"So let's make up some weird rules, watch people spend mega dollars, and go race"

Seems every racing forum in the world matchs this now. The regular gear head hasn't a single ounce of identification with hardly anything going down any kind of track these days.

SStrokerAce · Post by **SStrokerAce** » Sun Mar 20, 2005 8:52 am

Very true....

The problem with the Engine Masters is to make the contest fair and policeable you automatically open it up to lots of money.

Speaking of the Engine Masters.........

The more I look at those Street Race rules the more I like the 460 Ford for that. Looks like the best heads that they give you for those rules are the Kaase Ford Racing Super Cobra Jet heads. 400cfm and 6Xcc chambers on a 475... sounds good to me.

Did you look at the Turbo rules? Now way are you going to spin that thing over about 7000rpm very far with a turbo. The thing will be on the bad side of it's efficentcy curve by the time you shift.

Bret

panic · Post by **panic** » Sun Mar 20, 2005 9:29 am

"There is no such thing as a big block or small block Pontiac"
Oddly enough, that's what an older EMC rules said; in effect the Pontiac is classified as legal for both big and small block. Yes, there is only 1 bore spacing (4.62"), but when I pointed out that there are 2 deck heights (265 & 301 are more than 1" shorter), the response I got back was "We already knew that", and "it doesn't matter".
Except that the 301 has a shorter deck height than the small block Olds 350/403 etc.
If deck height is NOT a determinative factor, then there are no small block Olds either.

Cheapstreetduster · Post by **Cheapstreetduster** » Sun Mar 20, 2005 8:35 pm

i ran the predicessor class to this ; it was called cheapstreet
originally it was a $3000 smallblock engine claim rule..
the problem was the attached rules on the engine were screwy
they changed the rules to much/often wich made it very hard to comply.
even with the rules for this new class it morphed into ..
they take 2 steps forward with the rule changes and 3 steps back
oh by the way they make you run a rediculous small radial dot tire in this class ..wich is assinine...at the speed the turbo and power adders will reach.. just doesnt make a good big picture..if you ask me
cheap

SStrokerAce · Post by **SStrokerAce** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 12:13 am

panic wrote:"There is no such thing as a big block or small block Pontiac"
Oddly enough, that's what an older EMC rules said; in effect the Pontiac is classified as legal for both big and small block. Yes, there is only 1 bore spacing (4.62"), but when I pointed out that there are 2 deck heights (265 & 301 are more than 1" shorter), the response I got back was "We already knew that", and "it doesn't matter".
Except that the 301 has a shorter deck height than the small block Olds 350/403 etc.
If deck height is NOT a determinative factor, then there are no small block Olds either.

Yeah problem with the Pontiac is the manifold deal...... The rules don't give you any quality manifolds to play with on a short deck block. Remember Parkhurst is a big Poncho head... he has a 632 cube Pontiac in a 65 GTO. He's off running some other deal now, which is a shame. You can see that in the crappy coverage they gave this years EMC in the mag.

Bret

Post by **ClassKing** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 12:27 am

Thankfully parkhurst is off the contest. Got the boot. And his GTO "engine" pile isn't a Pontiac - it's all aftermarket crap that IF it exists, couldn't get out of it's own way unless Alan Johnson tuned it. Gotta love those writers that ride bicycles to work and dream of being mechanically minded.

SStrokerAce · Post by **SStrokerAce** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 5:44 pm

I suggested to them that they have the dyno pulls simulate more of a drag strip run with a small converter since they want to make it more of a durability test. Increased the amount of time in anger the motor sees 3 times. Hopefully they will impliment it next year.

ClassKing, I know Scott is a magazine guy, but I also know him personally, had beers with the man etc.... I would never talk smack about someone I haven't had person to person discussions in person, over the phone or on the net. I'll stick up for the guy because if I knew you as well and thought of you in a good light I'd do the same for you, just my principals. The guy basically invented the contest and brought it thru the bueracracy of Primedia with Mike Simpson. That's not an easy task. He's not a engineer by far but a car guy who had the idea to make magazine coverage more technical. The first few years of the contest coverage were GOOD because he fought to actually include a whole bunch of pages of tear downs and what makes those things tick. That's the point of it for the magazine, but the powers that be can't see that so the real esscence of it for the magazine has died. I hope Mike Petralia steps up and gets back to that. Between the Brit engineering race mags and some things like PHR there are not too many interesting magazines these days. God I've read some technical articles in sport compact magazines on turbos that are more informative then most of the dribble out there now.

As for aftermarket parts..... Thank god we have them IMHO if not we would still be doing things the way we did 15-20 years ago with stock parts. That's cool for SS racing, but where would the Ford Drag Racing Scene be today without these parts? I'm the son of a former Pontiac Engineer and all though I have a soft spot for them, my '64 GTO will never see a 389-468 boat anchor. Give me a good aftermarket SBC or LS1 anyday. Less weight and the same power, kinda helps with trying to make the old hunk corner.

Bret

Post by **ClassKing** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 7:59 pm

I'll bet ya I've had more beers and been to more titty bars with him than you. I never talk smack unless it's warranted. If you're good friends with him, bring him over and we'll itemize the crap he pulled with me. Of course he won't want to be coming to see me. I stand by the history he forged with me. He's a class A dipstick and he knows it.

Ask him about the time I let him drive the Project Freebird Firebird at Pomona, and told him he couldn't use the nitrous until I saw him make an eleven second pass first. HE never drove a fast car in his life and I wasn't about to send him down the track in a 10 second machine. I actually had second thoughts about letting him drive it at all. Keep this in mind, I'm the track announcer while this is going on. Mr. Wise guy pulls to the starting line, reaches over and arms the nitrous, lights come downs,and of course the bottle is OFF.

It wasn't bad enough he puked and stalled the engine, he ran the battery down trying to restart it. So, I'm on the mic giving him a big send up, (up to the point he screwed up,) and now I've got to run down and help push him ALL of the way back to the pits. So King Dog has embarrassed himself in front of the Pomona crowd - and takes it out on me.

That's just ONE topic. There's more facts. Not hearsay, which he has decided to condone in a BIG way.

Actually - none of this crap belongs on this site. F'it. Sorry.

SStrokerAce · Post by **SStrokerAce** » Tue Mar 22, 2005 11:55 pm

ClassKing wrote:Actually - none of this crap belongs on this site. F'it. Sorry.

That's about the best thing you said....

Never said he didn't have ego bud. I'm sure you have some buddies that have done some brainless stuff too, hell I know I have.

Lets end it at that.

Bret