Totalseal rings

[redliner]

Does anyone run totalseal rings? Are they gapless top and 2nd ring? Are they worth running? Lots less ring filing....

[1972ho]

It’s just gapless top or gapless second and you still need to file for a gap they just have another ring inside that makes it gapless it kind of looks like a oil retainer ring.

[redliner]

It’s just gapless top or gapless second and you still need to file for a gap they just have another ring inside that makes it gapless it kind of looks like a oil retainer ring.

I wasnt tryin to get lazy it just seems they would be a ring that overlaps with no gap. Are they used much anymore? Never a gapless top and 2nd ing?

[ClassAct]

It’s just gapless top or gapless second and you still need to file for a gap they just have another ring inside that makes it gapless it kind of looks like a oil retainer ring.

I wasnt tryin to get lazy it just seems they would be a ring that overlaps with no gap. Are they used much anymore? Never a gapless top and 2nd ing?

I use gapless tops in most anything I can't spend the time on the dyno to close up the gaps so a conventional ring to run essentially gapless. That's happened twice in my career and it was a time consuming task.

[NewbVetteGuy]

There's people on both sides of the gapless debate (as to whether gapless are "worth it" or not); plenty of older SpeedTalk threads on the subject.

I think there's at least a majority of people who would say, if you're going to buy gapless rings go with gapless top; non-gapless second ring.

IMHO (not worth much), gapless rings make the most sense if you want to OCCASIONALLY run a little Nitrous -then you can set a larger gap to be safe with some spray, but not lose pressure when running N/A.


Adam

[Alaskaracer]

Contrary to what you may read or have been told, gapless rings will not net you gains like you expect. They have a tendency to "flutter" which affects ring seal. No, Matt Hartford (total seal VP) doesn't run them in his pro stock either. Many dyno tests have proven they don't work as well as led to believe. I ran the gapless top in my stuff and had oil issues in the chamber. No matter what I did I'd get oil where it shouldn't be. Switched to conventional rings and no more issues. Nitrous DOES NOT like oil in the chambers, it will detonate. Most top builders don't use them and you won't see them in any pro stock. If they worked that well you would. Best ring pack is a ductile top, napier second. Thinner is better and lower tension to a point. You'd be surprised how much you can open a gap on a top ring before it starts to affect power.

[ClassAct]

Contrary to what you may read or have been told, gapless rings will not net you gains like you expect. They have a tendency to "flutter" which affects ring seal. No, Matt Hartford (total seal VP) doesn't run them in his pro stock either. Many dyno tests have proven they don't work as well as led to believe. I ran the gapless top in my stuff and had oil issues in the chamber. No matter what I did I'd get oil where it shouldn't be. Switched to conventional rings and no more issues. Nitrous DOES NOT like oil in the chambers, it will detonate. Most top builders don't use them and you won't see them in any pro stock. If they worked that well you would. Best ring pack is a ductile top, napier second. Thinner is better and lower tension to a point. You'd be surprised how much you can open a gap on a top ring before it starts to affect power.

Ok. Sounds like BS to me. I've dyno tested them MANY times, never had an oil user, never seen the flutter. Like anything else, the better the block, the better the bore finish, the better the finish and fit of the ring in the groove, the better the deal. An OE block like the GM 400 will respond to a gapless top ring and show much more improvement in power and blow by under load than say a quality aftermarket block.

IMO, it's nearly impossible to get rings that don't seal anymore. If you have oil use issues with ANY ring, get a good long look in the mirror.

[modok]

Total seal will make any kind of ring you want.
Including bad ideas.

[MadBill]

As we know this cuts both ways, but David Vizard is a fan of Gapless top rings.

[Krooser]

The last set of Venolia's I bought came with Total Seal gapless. Blown early Hemi.

My kids b mod pistons (Wiseco) came with Total Seal gapless. 12-1 SBC.

My SBM dirt motor had Total Seal gapless when I bought it.

Three different builders
...all gapless top rings.

If my govt. check is rich enough this SBM rebuild I'm doing will likely get the same.

Not a kool aid drinker...just think they are a good choice for an alky motor.

[jake197000]

two strokes use them but thats so you cant hook a ring my leakdown rates were very low when i used to race em

[jake197000]

and we used nitrous and turbos

[jake197000]

and after i had my pistons and chambers coated never burned down another one.pipes coated too

[jake197000]

most 2 strokes use a pin in the ring groove so the ring cant rotate

[MadBill]

The Gapless set I specced for a 680 HP 8,000 RPM 380" SBF road racer now has ~ 40 hrs. on it and after a valve touch-up the worst leakdown was 2%. I find that reassuring.

A number of people have said they made no more power with Gapless rings, but I haven't heard anyone claim to have made less.