Header Theory by Vince Roman from Burns @ PRI

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MadBill
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Re: Header Theory by Vince Roman from Burns @ PRI

Post by MadBill » Wed Dec 05, 2018 7:18 pm

exhausted wrote:
Wed Dec 05, 2018 6:44 pm
Inconel is 600 series stainless steel. A lot stronger and expensive. Allows .018-.025 wall headers.
I did a few sets for the Mazda 4 rotor prototype car in the early 90's. 321 18gauge sets would sag and deform from their own weight! Past orange to white hot when at full song. Inconel could handle it without issues.
Umm... the Stainless Steel composition charts I've see don't include any 600 or 700 series alloys and ones with as much as 75% nickel and as little as %3 iron don't qualify in my estimation.
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Re: Header Theory by Vince Roman from Burns @ PRI

Post by stealth » Wed Dec 05, 2018 7:25 pm

Inconel
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Re: Header Theory by Vince Roman from Burns @ PRI

Post by gmrocket » Wed Dec 05, 2018 7:37 pm

exhausted wrote:
Wed Dec 05, 2018 6:45 pm
gmrocket wrote:
Wed Dec 05, 2018 4:54 pm
It's time for a header shootout competition!

Let's see who's right
What are we shooting at?
Whatever you guys want...avg tq or hp, peak tq or hp?

On the dyno or in a car ,

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Re: Header Theory by Vince Roman from Burns @ PRI

Post by RevTheory » Wed Dec 05, 2018 7:57 pm

It would be nice to see you pick back up on your blog, Calvin.

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Re: Header Theory by Vince Roman from Burns @ PRI

Post by exhausted » Wed Dec 05, 2018 8:56 pm

RevTheory wrote:
Wed Dec 05, 2018 7:57 pm
It would be nice to see you pick back up on your blog, Calvin.
I'm probably gonna try and condense info and stories into a more structured work. There are so many aspects to it, probably wind up as a book.
I do not like to write things out.
And MadBill... you know I am not an engineer but someone told me once Inconel was a higher number SS. Works for me and I am not going to argue.
It's ornery stuff. Ha!
Calvin Elston
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Matthews, NC 28104
704-443-8088
Web: www.elstonheaders.com
Blog: www.exhausting101.com

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Re: Header Theory by Vince Roman from Burns @ PRI

Post by Jim2527 » Thu Dec 06, 2018 8:37 am

Calvin, you've mentioned a preference for 4-2-1 headers below a certain rpm. Are your 4-2-1 headers the same as 'tri Y'? Can you talk about the differences between a Tri-Y and 4-2-1 systems? I understand not wanting 90 degree firing cylinders going into the same 'Y'.

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Re: Header Theory by Vince Roman from Burns @ PRI

Post by exhausted » Thu Dec 06, 2018 8:59 am

Jim2527 wrote:
Thu Dec 06, 2018 8:37 am
Calvin, you've mentioned a preference for 4-2-1 headers below a certain rpm. Are your 4-2-1 headers the same as 'tri Y'? Can you talk about the differences between a Tri-Y and 4-2-1 systems? I understand not wanting 90 degree firing cylinders going into the same 'Y'.
Same thing.
Calvin Elston
Elston Exhaust Inc.
Matthews, NC 28104
704-443-8088
Web: www.elstonheaders.com
Blog: www.exhausting101.com

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Re: Header Theory by Vince Roman from Burns @ PRI

Post by Newold1 » Thu Dec 06, 2018 9:14 am

That cleared that up! :wink: =D>
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Re: Header Theory by Vince Roman from Burns @ PRI

Post by RevTheory » Thu Dec 06, 2018 10:43 am

I wonder if poor Calvin pulls his hair out when he sees an AMC dogleg port :x

OP, you've been quite gracious regarding your thread being hijacked.

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Re: Header Theory by Vince Roman from Burns @ PRI

Post by Momus » Thu Dec 06, 2018 2:12 pm

MadBill wrote:
Wed Dec 05, 2018 7:18 pm
exhausted wrote:
Wed Dec 05, 2018 6:44 pm
Inconel is 600 series stainless steel. A lot stronger and expensive. Allows .018-.025 wall headers.
I did a few sets for the Mazda 4 rotor prototype car in the early 90's. 321 18gauge sets would sag and deform from their own weight! Past orange to white hot when at full song. Inconel could handle it without issues.
Umm... the Stainless Steel composition charts I've see don't include any 600 or 700 series alloys and ones with as much as 75% nickel and as little as %3 iron don't qualify in my estimation.
625 and 718 grade Inconel are two used for exhaust tube construction Bill. Probably what Calvin mentioned.

OT but interesting paper on mortar tube extrusion using 718 Inconel:

https://apps.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/783416.pdf

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Re: Header Theory by Vince Roman from Burns @ PRI

Post by Newold1 » Thu Dec 06, 2018 4:45 pm

By all means anybody going to PRI should avail themselves of the knowledge stuffed in Vince's exhausted brain. He has forgotten more about headers like Calvin than most of us will ever know! Try to learn from the masters and put into play their years of well earned experience!Most of us will not have the time and ability to learn all what they can educate us in.
The Older I Get, The Dumber I Get :wink:

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Re: Header Theory by Vince Roman from Burns @ PRI

Post by MadBill » Sat Dec 08, 2018 11:52 am

David Vizard wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 7:22 pm
It would be interesting to hear Vince's thoughts on the importance of equal length on primary pipes for a V8u.
DV
Anyone know if this was addressed?
Felix, qui potuit rerum cognscere causas.

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Re: Header Theory by Vince Roman from Burns @ PRI

Post by exhausted » Sat Dec 08, 2018 3:22 pm

Newold1 wrote:
Thu Dec 06, 2018 4:45 pm
By all means anybody going to PRI should avail themselves of the knowledge stuffed in Vince's exhausted brain. He has forgotten more about headers like Calvin than most of us will ever know! Try to learn from the masters and put into play their years of well earned experience!Most of us will not have the time and ability to learn all what they can educate us in.
Wow, thanks for the nice words. Do I know you?
Calvin Elston
Elston Exhaust Inc.
Matthews, NC 28104
704-443-8088
Web: www.elstonheaders.com
Blog: www.exhausting101.com

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Re: Header Theory by Vince Roman from Burns @ PRI

Post by exhausted » Sat Dec 08, 2018 3:24 pm

MadBill wrote:
Sat Dec 08, 2018 11:52 am
David Vizard wrote:
Fri Nov 30, 2018 7:22 pm
It would be interesting to hear Vince's thoughts on the importance of equal length on primary pipes for a V8u.
DV
Anyone know if this was addressed?
I would bet money his answer echos me. Of course it's important but there are other factors.
Calvin Elston
Elston Exhaust Inc.
Matthews, NC 28104
704-443-8088
Web: www.elstonheaders.com
Blog: www.exhausting101.com

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Re: Header Theory by Vince Roman from Burns @ PRI

Post by Newold1 » Sat Dec 08, 2018 5:19 pm

Hello Calvin:

No I have not personally met or talked with you however your successes, history, experience and reputation with headers is well known in the performance world. Thank you for your contributions here on Speedtalk. My feeling is we can probably count 10 -12 expert header people in the American racing and aftermarket and I think you might own one of those fingers! :wink:

Regards,
Newold1
The Older I Get, The Dumber I Get :wink:

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