Moroso 21237

[cgarb]

I have a Fabricated aluminum Moroso pan on a friends drag race car I am driving. Its an 8.90 car that has a wet sump oil system, Melling Shark pump and matching pickup. It doesn't lose oil pressure totally, but will turn the light on in the shutdown (set at 25lbs) #1 Will this hurt anything? #2 Is there anything I can do to try and stop it? The engine has a crank scraper also. It wont do it running 1/8th mile where I can coast but at 1/4 mile events and 1/8 mile only tracks where I have to get on the brakes harder it will. I try and Neutral the car (but I'm not fond of that much either) to keep the rpm's down when it loses pressure. I know dry sump is the answer...but its not going to happen because its not my car.

[lefty o]

is there a baffle/trap door in the sump of that pan?

[BOOT]

accusump?

[cgarb]

The pan has a trap door baffle and a windage screen. I'm going to at the end of this season try and see what the pan looks like its doing with parts washer solvent sloshing around and see if there is a way I can modify or make another baffle to help slow the oil from getting to the front so fast. Its not a deep sump style pan, has a small rear sump, I'm thinking more oil is already past the baffle anyway so that leaves less in the sump for the trap door to trap. I wonder if a more traditional rear sump style pan would control the oil better, with the majority of the oil being in the rear of the pan by the pickup.

[SupStk]

I'm wondering if the majority of oil is sloshing to the front of sump while braking and the oil trapped by the pickup is being pumped out. Kind of a common thing with big, flat bottom pans.
As mentioned an accusump will keep the pressure up.

[Frankshaft]

I hate box pans. They don't work. I don't know why they still make them. For a BBC the 2 best wet sump pans are a Milodon 31187 rear sump pan, will clear a 4.75 crank with a few minor dings added, or bolt on up to 4.5 stroke. Will maintain rock solid oil pressure from the hit to the clip. Good breaking oil pressure, and will add some power compared to some of the more street/strip type pans. About $500 ish. The best wet sump pan available, I have tried all of them, is a Moroso 20373. They make good power, and also keep rock solid oil pressure. According to the race pack, it stays solid the whole time, including breaking, on a vehicle that is accelerating and stopping a good bit faster than an 8.90 car, and will clear 4.75 strokes no problem, they do use the drce bolt arrangement and have access plugs for the bolts on the pan rail. They are about $850 ish.

I think the idea with a box pan, is they are trying to mimic a dry sump advantage in a wet sump pan. Its a bad idea to do that. I haven't found one yet that holds solid oil pressure like the 2 above. The 21237 pan is an ok pan, but the 2 I listed above are better.

[cgarb]

I don't think those BBC oil pans will work on the man's small block...lol. Thanks for the help though, I agree about the rear sump, I have an el'cheapo rear sump pan on my car and I have no issues getting on the brakes. I'm not as fast as his car either. I may give a good rear sump pan a shot.

[Frankshaft]

I don't think those BBC oil pans will work on the man's small block...lol. Thanks for the help though, I agree about the rear sump, I have an el'cheapo rear sump pan on my car and I have no issues getting on the brakes. I'm not as fast as his car either. I may give a good rear sump pan a shot.

, good point. Had the part numbers mixed up. Anyhow, the milodon pan, but for a sbc works just as well as for the BBC. I have used that pan engines spinning 8600. Same deal, solid oil pressure thru out.

[cgarb]

Update on this issue. I went to do an oil change on this car not this past weekend, but the week before and found a good size chunk of weld stuck to the drain plug magnet. The owner said put oil in it and run it, but it would worry me to death so I pulled the pan. I thought it was a piece of the crank scraper that I had welded a few pieces on to fill a large gap. It was either fill the 3 or 4 large gaps or grind a half inch off of everything else....I just made filler pieces and cut the extra off the outside edge and redrilled the pan bolt holes on the scraper. Anyway, turns out it was a tackweld that came off the pickup tube. I usually Tig weld those at my work, but it didn't work out that time and I put 3 mig tacks on it. It's still bolted on tight and the 2 other tacks are still there so no worries. While the pan was off I fabricated a baffle that extends from the vertical wall the trap door baffles are and extends rearward towards the back of the pan. I cut a clearance hole in it for the oil pump and pickup and it bolts in with mostly the windage screen attachment bolts. I thought for sure that would fix the issue of losing pressure when I hit the brakes because there was nothing there keeping the oil from splashing overtop of that vertical wall the trap doors are in. Got it all back on and running this past weekend and it still loses pressure when you brake hard, but it does seem to recover quicker when you let off. Has anyone messed around with pickup tube position in the sump with decent results? I know I have to be careful because the pickup is towards the rear of the pan so you have oil at launch and acceleration. I was wondering is just a small move like instead of just behind the oil pump to just in front of the oil pump would make a difference?

[redliner]

Update on this issue. I went to do an oil change on this car not this past weekend, but the week before and found a good size chunk of weld stuck to the drain plug magnet. The owner said put oil in it and run it, but it would worry me to death so I pulled the pan. I thought it was a piece of the crank scraper that I had welded a few pieces on to fill a large gap. It was either fill the 3 or 4 large gaps or grind a half inch off of everything else....I just made filler pieces and cut the extra off the outside edge and redrilled the pan bolt holes on the scraper. Anyway, turns out it was a tackweld that came off the pickup tube. I usually Tig weld those at my work, but it didn't work out that time and I put 3 mig tacks on it. It's still bolted on tight and the 2 other tacks are still there so no worries. While the pan was off I fabricated a baffle that extends from the vertical wall the trap door baffles are and extends rearward towards the back of the pan. I cut a clearance hole in it for the oil pump and pickup and it bolts in with mostly the windage screen attachment bolts. I thought for sure that would fix the issue of losing pressure when I hit the brakes because there was nothing there keeping the oil from splashing overtop of that vertical wall the trap doors are in. Got it all back on and running this past weekend and it still loses pressure when you brake hard, but it does seem to recover quicker when you let off. Has anyone messed around with pickup tube position in the sump with decent results? I know I have to be careful because the pickup is towards the rear of the pan so you have oil at launch and acceleration. I was wondering is just a small move like instead of just behind the oil pump to just in front of the oil pump would make a difference?

I had a problem with oil psi loss on the top end like you described, I went to a pickup that is directly under the pump! No more problems!!!

[cgarb]

It has a Melling shark pump in it now, the cast iron version. I see they make a billet aluminum pump with the integral pickup right on the bottom of the pump....hmmm. Maybe worth a shot to try.

[BOOT]

The billet style pumps put the pickup at the very rear pass corner of the pan. I put one on a car and built some baffles around it because I fear that maybe on decel pressure may be an issue, have not had a chance to run that car yet to see it does. Plus just read of a guy who had that exact problem with his billet pump(no clue on the pan or any baffles he was using) I'll still try this one, it's not anything special but if it's bad I'll pull it and put something else on it.

[Kevin Johnson]

Pictures.

Very often the pan number given does not match what a customer actually has (variations in manufacturing/design over time). Seeing what is actually in the pan from multiple angles helps alot.

[tenxal]

You mentioned it triggers the light set @ 25#. The question is: how far below 25# does it go?

25# pressure on shutdown is not a problem. Mine will bounce the needle around 10-15# at times, no issues.

[redliner]

The billet style pumps put the pickup at the very rear pass corner of the pan. I put one on a car and built some baffles around it because I fear that maybe on decel pressure may be an issue, have not had a chance to run that car yet to see it does. Plus just read of a guy who had that exact problem with his billet pump(no clue on the pan or any baffles he was using) I'll still try this one, it's not anything special but if it's bad I'll pull it and put something else on it.

THe billet pump I have puts the pickup directly under the pump.I run 10.14 @131 and have no problems on deceleration.