Speedmaster aluminum block

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blykins
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Re: Speedmaster aluminum block

Post by blykins »

That's one thing I agree with you on.
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Re: Speedmaster aluminum block

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Its nice to see your coming around Brent :lol: Just ribbing you!
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Re: Speedmaster aluminum block

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My little 620 hp 354C dyno mule had a .050" wall thickness on one cylinder.
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Re: Speedmaster aluminum block

Post by Steve.k »

Yes daughters 600 horser has a .070 sleeve. Think it was the straightest of all of them.
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Re: Speedmaster aluminum block

Post by swampbuggy »

Steve... .200+ cylinders...i am assuming you are meaning .200" over bored ????? Mark H.
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Re: Speedmaster aluminum block

Post by mekilljoydammit »

hoffman900 wrote: Tue Jul 10, 2018 7:09 pm In SCCA D-Sports Racer (now Prototype 2), the hot set up are turbocharged 660cc I4 sportbike engines. They make about 330hp or over 8hp/ci. Not super reliable, but they are good for at least 40 minutes (60-80ish miles, or 240 to 320 drag race runs with hard downshifts included) in road racing trim.

Those engines are all aluminum.
I know this is getting off topic but screw it, this is more interesting than the rest of what's going on in this thread.

Unless you know different, I can think of only one guy that was successful with the 660cc turbo combination and he had a hell of a lot of money into all of it. SCCA threw a restrictor on it the next year, and turbos are explicitly not allowed in P2. The guy did what he came to the race to do though, albeit I don't think anyone would say it was reliable - race pace was nowhere near what it was doing in testing, and he turned it down even further after the first couple laps because he was sitting on a grenade, but it sure did finish the race in 1st. Trap speeds into turn 5 were something like 20mph up on everyone else though.

I've heard tell a few others were working on a package like that at the time, but that was the only one I've seen that worked.
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Re: Speedmaster aluminum block

Post by Steve.k »

swampbuggy wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 12:40 pm Steve... .200+ cylinders...i am assuming you are meaning .200" over bored ????? Mark H.
Mark on alloy blocks with 4.155 bore size we still have .200 thick liner. With cast block we can go 4.25 with at least that.
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Re: Speedmaster aluminum block

Post by blykins »

Steve.k wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:08 pm
swampbuggy wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 12:40 pm Steve... .200+ cylinders...i am assuming you are meaning .200" over bored ????? Mark H.
Mark on alloy blocks with 4.155 bore size we still have .200 thick liner. With cast block we can go 4.25 with at least that.
How do you go 4.250" bore while keeping the factory SBF bore spacing?
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Re: Speedmaster aluminum block

Post by grant6395 »

Question about dry sleeve thickness.when bored out to 4.155( on this speedmaster jobbie lol)
It states 4.155 max. It's 4.0 now. That will leave approx .055 left for thickness.besides moving all over the place more than likely, does this sound viable? Seems thin to me. Thanks for the responses, and the opinions on block materials. I never expected it to blow up into 15 pages. Good read
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Re: Speedmaster aluminum block

Post by blykins »

With a 4.380" bore spacing and a 4.155" bore, you would theoretically have .112" sleeve thickness for each cylinder.
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Re: Speedmaster aluminum block

Post by Zmechanic »

Steve, give any thought to "HIP"ing those blocks?
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Re: Speedmaster aluminum block

Post by grant6395 »

blykins wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 1:24 pm With a 4.380" bore spacing and a 4.155" bore, you would theoretically have .112" sleeve thickness for each cylinder.
Not on the bottom of the sleeve where measured. On the top where they are interlocked you will.
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Re: Speedmaster aluminum block

Post by grant6395 »

There are some guys I know that have gone 4.250 on sbf bores. I myself have gone 4.220. It's thin, but it seals.
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Re: Speedmaster aluminum block

Post by Steve.k »

Brent yes made mistake. We figured 4.25 on cast block however you need copper gasket or wire ring. Is doable. On alloy we had .200 liners at 4.155 that left us .080. Which with ductile iron lots they say. Sorry for confusion there. With the 9.5 deck now he figures we can really push cubes up. I have to write all this down. To much for old guy to remember in order.sce I guess said they have no problem making a gasket to 4.215 with confidence of holding. He is contemplating a solid cast block also.cast aluminum that is.
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Re: Speedmaster aluminum block

Post by treyrags »

Headguy wrote: Wed Jul 11, 2018 12:37 am
statsystems wrote: Tue Jul 10, 2018 11:07 pm
Dave Koehler wrote: Tue Jul 10, 2018 10:44 pm For crying out loud, will you children stop it.
13 pages of name calling and nothing learned.
Go get a Snickers.


Even that won't help. You have people who are professional argument makers. You can post your real world experience, backed up by professional people no less that Larry Meaux and Darin Morgan and they still want to tell you how stupid you are because so and so runs his car on a dirt bull ring with a stupid weight limit blah blah blah. Or how an inline 4 can be compared to a V-8 that has had its architecture blown out beyond what any engineer ever had in mind when designing it.

I mean really...can any thinking, intelligent man not see the folly in such thinking? Let's take a liter 4 cylinder, and increase its bore, stroke and RPM increased in an equal amount to what the standard American V-8 has been and THEN tell me how good the aluminum is.

Not one of us has said aluminum doesn't have a place in engine blocks. If you are under 1000 HP and N/A and if your stupid rules don't allow flyweight shit the cast iron will beat it every time.

I had a customer back in 1998 with a dragster. I begged him not to buy an aluminum block for his car. He figured weight was better than HP. It wasn't. Since it was a rear engine car, he had to add weight to the car to get it to hook and he gave up power.

He stepped on his own dick. The car never performed like he thought it would, but did exactly what I told him it would. A couple seasons later he parked the car.
I haven't had that problem, I have built hundreds of aluminum engines. And had a few back to back te sts. The most I lost was about 1.5 %.
Thank you for speaking in terms of %. It wears me out to see people quote "X" horsepower gains or losses like it doesn't matter what the engine displacement or horsepower range is involved. I recently built and dynoed an aluminum block (Ford Racing) small block. It's a middle of the road street engine that made 1.4 per inch. I used the same exact combination as the previous build except for the block. It was down 1%. I'm not sure the dyno is even that repeatable lol. After 13 pulls the exhaust ports were gray and bone dry. The breathers were also dry. BSFC .39 - .45. I respect Larry and Darin's findings and believe them completely and their findings are probably true in many cases, especially as you approach 2 hp/ci and up.But you can't paint everything with a broad brush.
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