for what it is worth, bushed vs needle roller lifters

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Belgian1979
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Re: for what it is worth, bushed vs needle roller lifters

Post by Belgian1979 » Mon Aug 07, 2017 3:29 pm

In-Tech wrote:Thank you for the reply. The lash is a great way to keep track of wear. Just so I'm clear...you are using bushed lifters AND a rev kit???

I am quite aware of the advantage of a rev kit and needle lifters, I am interested if there are wear issues with bushed lifters and rev kits or is that brand dependant, the bushed morels that Chris Straub posted look promising. Are the Isky and Crowers pressure fed as well?

Thanks, trying to learn what has been tried and proven.
I still use the needle bearing lifters. No experience with bushed rollers and a rev kit. Personally I think these do not match well.

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Re: for what it is worth, bushed vs needle roller lifters

Post by In-Tech » Mon Aug 07, 2017 3:39 pm

Belgian1979 wrote:
In-Tech wrote:Thank you for the reply. The lash is a great way to keep track of wear. Just so I'm clear...you are using bushed lifters AND a rev kit???

I am quite aware of the advantage of a rev kit and needle lifters, I am interested if there are wear issues with bushed lifters and rev kits or is that brand dependant, the bushed morels that Chris Straub posted look promising. Are the Isky and Crowers pressure fed as well?

Thanks, trying to learn what has been tried and proven.
I still use the needle bearing lifters. No experience with bushed rollers and a rev kit. Personally I think these do not match well.
That's my "feeling" as well, anytime I can use a rev kit, use needles. Anytime I can't use a rev kit, use bushed. Once again, looking for experiences.
Heat is energy, energy is horsepower...but you gotta control the heat.
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Re: for what it is worth, bushed vs needle roller lifters

Post by Warp Speed » Mon Aug 07, 2017 5:38 pm

In-Tech wrote: Once again, looking for experiences.
Cup, Truck and Xfinity series all use needle bearing lifters........no rev kits!

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Re: for what it is worth, bushed vs needle roller lifters

Post by desoto30 » Mon Aug 07, 2017 6:21 pm

How much idle time & what would be the service interval?

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Re: for what it is worth, bushed vs needle roller lifters

Post by In-Tech » Mon Aug 07, 2017 6:42 pm

Warp Speed wrote:
In-Tech wrote: Once again, looking for experiences.
Cup, Truck and Xfinity series all use needle bearing lifters........no rev kits!
Interesting, something to be said about something not being beneficial =D> Obviously not a street or marine environment where long idle times occur, good info anyway. Thanks :) And feel free to divulge any other testing you guys have done along this thread title. [-o< :wink:
Heat is energy, energy is horsepower...but you gotta control the heat.
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Re: for what it is worth, bushed vs needle roller lifters

Post by cjperformance » Mon Aug 07, 2017 8:02 pm

cjperformance wrote:Anything to keep the roller in contact with the cam (like a rev kit) will help life of roller or bushed type, keeping the lifter wheel rotating at libe surface speed is a massive key to lifespan, needle or bushed.
In your bushed v needle rocker scenario, first up was the geometry of each rocker near identical?
As I said back here ↑ , ie- there is more to the rev kit than stopping the lifter smacking the lobe,,, its more about keeping roller wheel AT lobe surface speed , this also helps maintain the oil wedge. The lower the average engine/lobe/roller wheel speeds are (low speed running and idle time) the more important this becomes to increase life of either type of lifter.
Craig.

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Re: for what it is worth, bushed vs needle roller lifters

Post by Nick Campagna » Mon Aug 07, 2017 8:39 pm

What kind of spring pressure is used for the rev kit portion ?
Is the defect in what I see, or what I'm seeing with ?

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Re: for what it is worth, bushed vs needle roller lifters

Post by Mpcoluv » Mon Aug 07, 2017 9:15 pm

So what lifters are Cup guys running?

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Re: for what it is worth, bushed vs needle roller lifters

Post by cjperformance » Mon Aug 07, 2017 9:28 pm

Nick Campagna wrote:What kind of spring pressure is used for the rev kit portion ?
30/35# as a start and is plenty to do the job on a streeter to keep the wheel on the lobe for the saturday night cruisers! , more for heavier lifters/more agressive lobes, the most I have ever used is 55#
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Re: for what it is worth, bushed vs needle roller lifters

Post by nhrastocker » Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:36 pm

F-BIRD'88 wrote:Someone should develop a tool that checks the valve lash when the engine is running.
Possible by lazer/optical analysis of the running rocker arm/valve tip interface.

If you are checking the valve lash ACCURATELY with the lifter on the back side of the cam lobe, each time at the same temperature, then theoretically if the valve lash does change, then something is or did bend/deflect beyond yield point or something is wearing, something has moved or.... something....$$$

"much" is a relative, subjective term.
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Re: for what it is worth, bushed vs needle roller lifters

Post by Warp Speed » Tue Aug 08, 2017 4:48 am

desoto30 wrote:How much idle time & what would be the service interval?
Of course the top NASCAR series I mentioned doesn't have the low rpm or extended isle time some full street cars would see. But then again, most wouldn't run anywhere near the valve lift or acceleration the system sees in our application.

While we are on the subject of street duty, what is everyone's idea of idle and low speed rpm mentioned?
Are we talking about a 700rpm idle and 1200-1800 rpm cruise?

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Re: for what it is worth, bushed vs needle roller lifters

Post by cjperformance » Tue Aug 08, 2017 5:14 am

Ballpark 800-1000 idle , cruise 1300 - 2800 is what I call a Saturday night cruiser for solid roller.
Craig.

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Re: for what it is worth, bushed vs needle roller lifters

Post by Nick Campagna » Tue Aug 08, 2017 8:09 am

cjperformance wrote:
Nick Campagna wrote:What kind of spring pressure is used for the rev kit portion ?
30/35# as a start and is plenty to do the job on a streeter to keep the wheel on the lobe for the saturday night cruisers! , more for heavier lifters/more agressive lobes, the most I have ever used is 55#
Thanks.
Is the defect in what I see, or what I'm seeing with ?

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Re: for what it is worth, bushed vs needle roller lifters

Post by cstraub » Tue Aug 08, 2017 9:49 am

Mpcoluv wrote:So what lifters are Cup guys running?
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http://www.straubtechnologies.com
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Re: for what it is worth, bushed vs needle roller lifters

Post by Warp Speed » Tue Aug 08, 2017 10:09 am

cjperformance wrote:Ballpark 800-1000 idle , cruise 1300 - 2800 is what I call a Saturday night cruiser for solid roller.
Why would you consider a solid roller for this type of mild application, when a modern hydraulic roller would be more than enough?

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