titanium valves and dry guides

General engine tech -- Drag Racing to Circle Track

Moderator: Team

steve cowan
Guru
Guru
Posts: 2253
Joined: Wed Jul 27, 2011 5:22 am
Location: brisbane AUSTRALIA

Re: titanium valves and dry guides

Post by steve cowan »

jesel 005.JPG
jesel 004.JPG
jesel 003.JPG
jesel 002.JPG
jesel 001.JPG
craig,
you beat me to it lol
i believe it is pushrod cup and pushrod rubbing
i have not seen this before,damn did not sleep real good last night
anyway,i checked all the valves with LSM on car valvespring checker there is no binding of the valves in the guide or seal squeak
removed rockers and pushrods and inspected,i can not see a problem anywhere,checked interference of pushrod,intake bolt etc all good
i then proceeded to put some extreme pressure lube on pushrod tips
noise pretty well gone
cranked engine over on the key with sparkplugs out to get oil up top,takes about 15 seconds
let sit for a minute noise gone
let sit for ten minutes noise back

conclusion-yes it is the pushrod cup
is this a problem?
i am hoping not but any thoughts appriciated
steve c
cjperformance wrote:Are you sure its not coming from the pushrod ball/rocker seat? Find a noisey one, remove the rocker, moly the pushrod ball/rocker seat set lash and see if its still noisey.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
steve c
"Pretty don't make power"
User avatar
modok
Guru
Guru
Posts: 3321
Joined: Sun Jun 06, 2010 1:50 am
Location:

Re: titanium valves and dry guides

Post by modok »

Pushrod tips and cups may take a while to wear-in, and can be a rather poor fit when new.
Never seen it cause a real problem, just a little lash variation until it wears in.
If they are good quality material, it may take a LONG time to wear-in.
cjperformance
Guru
Guru
Posts: 3661
Joined: Tue Aug 19, 2008 7:20 am
Location: South Australia

Re: titanium valves and dry guides

Post by cjperformance »

Ah great, cause found !
Just inspect all balls/cups for heat damage or scuffing, if it looks fine all good.
It wont be doing that when its running due to the constant feed of oil. This is one reason that even with a roller cam I still like to get the engine basically run in with less spring pressure, can you remove an in er spring and do even 1 or 2 hours running around in the street if course not using high rpm?
You will most likely find that with a few miles on the engine therefore a bit more 'bed in' in the cups/balls that it will stop doing this. Also, some crane Super lube for a while will help.
Craig.
steve cowan
Guru
Guru
Posts: 2253
Joined: Wed Jul 27, 2011 5:22 am
Location: brisbane AUSTRALIA

Re: titanium valves and dry guides

Post by steve cowan »

craig,
thanks for the great ideas
i can take the inner spring out if need be
its a bit of a mission in the car but i can do it
PSI 230 seat load 600 on the nose
i have around 1 hr of run time on this engine on the street
i am sort of thinking i might of left this a bit late for inner spring removal
i actually did not know you could run a solid roller with 680'' lift with less spring load
i thought the valve might loft even at lower engine speeds but this me only thinking out loud
one good thing is the engine has sealed up well
assembly leakdown 8-10%
after initial start up,oil and filter change
top up with joe gibbs run in oil and 1 hr or so run time on the hwy
leakdown 2-6%
i am going to leave the joe gibbs in for a couple hundred kms and then swich to ULX 110 20/50
again thanks craig and everyone else who helped out
steve c
steve c
"Pretty don't make power"
pamotorman
Guru
Guru
Posts: 2802
Joined: Thu Mar 06, 2014 11:55 pm
Location:

Re: titanium valves and dry guides

Post by pamotorman »

I always used moly kote on push rod tips when putting the vale train together so no dry starts.
wyrmrider
Guru
Guru
Posts: 6941
Joined: Thu Jan 10, 2013 10:52 pm
Location:

Re: titanium valves and dry guides

Post by wyrmrider »

check with the vendors to be sure the radius on the tips and cups are compatible
englertracing
Guru
Guru
Posts: 1547
Joined: Thu Sep 29, 2011 8:55 am
Location:

Re: titanium valves and dry guides

Post by englertracing »

Frankshaft wrote:Ti valves aren't solid Ti material. The stems are coated with some sort of thick moly coating, that makes them compatible with the guides. Ever seen a Ti valve with chunks missing on the stem? That's the moly coating missing. According to the manley, Ferrea, etc, its not an issue. So, unless the seal is squeegeeing all the oil off, I doubt its that.

The Molly coating is old school and now bottom shelf.
The new stuff is chromium nitride
And the top shelf is titanium aluminum nitride

Del west are Cr N
The exceldyne are CrN or TiAlNi
Frankshaft
Guru
Guru
Posts: 1037
Joined: Sun Jul 05, 2015 6:01 pm
Location:

Re: titanium valves and dry guides

Post by Frankshaft »

^^^, ok, I wasn't sure exactly what the coating was, but, they are coated none the less. That's all my point was.
kosky racing
New Member
New Member
Posts: 41
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2013 4:13 pm
Location:

Re: titanium valves and dry guides

Post by kosky racing »

We had bearings in rockers squeak when going bad also the same with a roller lifter -sounded like it was coming from the valve :?
Post Reply