460 Ford build

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prairiehotrodder
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460 Ford build

Post by prairiehotrodder » Mon Mar 06, 2017 3:55 pm

I built a low buck 460 Ford a few years ago for an 87 mustang street / strip car that i had. Wasn't to serious, just a set of forged pistons to get 9.5 CR with Dove heads and crane hyd flat tappet cam, weiand stealth intake and 750 holley vac carb. It worked ok and ran 12.2 at 112 with 3.27 gears and a 2000 stall in the C6. I sold the car, the guy blew it up after awhile. Wants me to build another engine for it. Will spend at bit more money and hopefully make more power. He now has some C9 heads which i was gonna do a basic cleanup port job. Looking for 500 hp. I'm thinking of going to a single plain intake, 10 -1 CR, around 235 @ .050 on a 108 LSA, 850 holley DP, hopefully get some 4.10's into the car. Maybe a 3500 stall. Sound reasonable? Any tricks for a 460? I know they need decking.
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Re: 460 Ford build

Post by Carnut1 » Mon Mar 06, 2017 4:12 pm

Not sure of that casting but some 460 heads I have seen and worked on have a poor exhaust port that really needs some porting help.
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Re: 460 Ford build

Post by turbo2256b » Mon Mar 06, 2017 7:47 pm

I ported some DOVE heads for my 86 dualy 515/525 lift cam intake flow was 330 cfm. At any rate used a performer intake a stealth an orig torker (ported a bit) and a Torker II.
The Stealth was the worst figure its for some large cube stroker motor. orig torker ported guessing it was a bit better than the performer more like an RPM my guess. The Torker II relay kicked butt truck weighed in at 7000 some lbs

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Re: 460 Ford build

Post by F-BIRD'88 » Mon Mar 06, 2017 10:15 pm

Get a Comp Cams Magnum solid street roller
Single pattern 288-288-244-244 .366 Lobe lift 108 to 110LSA ( Comp lobe #1476

Or Dual pattern version 280-288 238-244 110LSA .366 .366" lobe lift Lobe #'s 1474 in #1476 ex.
These Magnum Street Roller Cams work great in big blocks .020" hot lash you can play with that a bit to good effect.
Can use Performer RPM dual Plane or single plane manifold.

Call Comp Cams to custom order. Ask for the optional distributor gear if you want it.
The 429-460 BBF like the BBC has a big heavy valvetrain and high ratio rockers.
A mechanical cam is better and this one will rock.

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Re: 460 Ford build

Post by DanE2 » Mon Mar 06, 2017 10:24 pm

C8-C9-Dove Same head

Get in touch with Scotty J. AKA "The Mad Porter". He is a specialist in porting 385 series heads. For a small fee you have access to his detailed website with many pictures and instructions on how to port those heads.

Because of the poor exhaust ports, get a custom cam with specs specific to the big block Ford.
Many cam companies give you Chevy specs for your Ford cam. The 385 series engine has it own
requirements. For instance, on your 235 degree intake duration, you might have about 248 degrees exhaust duration so as to allow the cylinder to "blow down" sufficiently. Again, have "The Mad Porter" or Randy at (rmcompetition 586 909 1591) spec your cam. These two are excellent in setting specs for the 385 series engine.

Zero deck the block, more or less, and set up your quench at about .040".

The RPM and the Torquer 2 are both very good manifolds and which to use would probably depend on the RPM range of the engine. The Victor works well in the upper RPM ranges.

Total timing around 34 degrees. Test and Tune from there.

These engines like a lot of carb. The dual plane intake more than the single plane intake.

The stock block and crankshaft are very strong. Having the stock crank offset ground to 4.15
inches with a 2.2 inch journal really brings the large intake ports alive.

Most blocks will take a 4.44" bore, a few will go to 4.5"
Last edited by DanE2 on Mon Mar 06, 2017 10:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 460 Ford build

Post by DanE2 » Mon Mar 06, 2017 10:27 pm

Once the RPMs start to build, these engines do NOT like single pattern cams.

A solid flat tappet cam or solid roller cam work very well in these engines. NO hydraulic roller camshaft in these engines as the taller body of the HR cam throws the valve train geometry off. However, with a bolt down rocker instead of a stud mounted rocker, a HR can be used successfully.

Paul Kane's website at HIGH FLOW Dynamics will tell you what you need to know about the oiling system, what modifications to make to the 385 series engine, and sell you blueprinted oil pumps and many more items related to the oiling system. And more.

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Re: 460 Ford build

Post by prairiehotrodder » Mon Mar 06, 2017 11:10 pm

I've dealt with the mad porter before. Actually when i built my first 460 i was searching a junkyard for dove heads. The owner told me there was a set of heads in the trunk of a mustang II. I looked and there was a set of D0er Cobra jet heads. I got them for nothing. I traded them to the mad porter for a set of dove heads that were ready to go and a new stealth intake. He was happy and i was happy. They were worth more than my whole car and they had the right date code for his project.

Thanks for all the help guys, this is gonna be a mid to low buck build so i doubt it will get a roller cam. I'd like to use one but i'm gonna just put together a combo that has a few good pieces that will leave room to grow later. A good short block that may get some better heads and bigger cam a couple years down the road. I'll definitely look in to a dual pattern cam based on your advice.
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Re: 460 Ford build

Post by prairiehotrodder » Mon Mar 06, 2017 11:18 pm

Hey DanE2 , if i went to the offset ground 4.15 stroke, what rods and pistons would i use? Chevy stuff?
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Re: 460 Ford build

Post by F-BIRD'88 » Mon Mar 06, 2017 11:24 pm

Check out this Speedmaster 79 "Podium" BBF 429 intake.

Allows you to bolt on Dual Quads.
Allows you to monkey with the plenum to your hearts content to improve it.
Allows you to bolt on a blower like the 671 or the Weiand 177 blower
Now or later.

Allows you to run a Blow thru set up with dual quads in a carb box
Now or later with a Centrifugal blower like the
TorqStorm blower or.....

Can run N/A power and upgrade to supercharged power later.
https://speedmaster79.com/pce1471124-fo ... old-satin/

Tons of potential.... I'd look at adding a plenum divider to sweeten it up.
Great with dual carbs and nitrous too.

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Re: 460 Ford build

Post by prairiehotrodder » Mon Mar 06, 2017 11:46 pm

Some quick research shows a Scat chevy rod # 2-icr6700 6.7" length with a 2.2 big end and a .990 pin end along with a SRP #154166 piston kit and that 4.15 offset ground stroke should put me at around 502 cubes. I guess i don't know if the chevy rod has the right width to fit on the 460 crank. Not sure if this is worth it or not.
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Re: 460 Ford build

Post by Walter R. Malik » Mon Mar 06, 2017 11:49 pm

prairiehotrodder wrote:I built a low buck 460 Ford a few years ago for an 87 mustang street / strip car that i had. Wasn't to serious, just a set of forged pistons to get 9.5 CR with Dove heads and crane hyd flat tappet cam, weiand stealth intake and 750 holley vac carb. It worked ok and ran 12.2 at 112 with 3.27 gears and a 2000 stall in the C6. I sold the car, the guy blew it up after awhile. Wants me to build another engine for it. Will spend at bit more money and hopefully make more power. He now has some C9 heads which i was gonna do a basic cleanup port job. Looking for 500 hp. I'm thinking of going to a single plain intake, 10 -1 CR, around 235 @ .050 on a 108 LSA, 850 holley DP, hopefully get some 4.10's into the car. Maybe a 3500 stall. Sound reasonable? Any tricks for a 460? I know they need decking.
brian

The C8, C9 and D0 heads are relatively the same with just the thermactor bosses and passageway being different. The ones with no thermactor at all are best but, all of them NEED hardened exhaust seats for today's pump gasoline.

For a 10/1 ratio engine, find some D3VE heads, mill 'em .030" and use flat-top pistons to get that ratio. Use aftermarket "Bolt Down" roller rockers with a Comp Cams 34-246-4; 276AH-10 hydraulic camshaft; (about .545" valve lift is all the heads will accept, without shortening the valve guide tops). You could probably use one of their "Mutha Thumper" grind camshafts, too.
Get an Edelbrock "Air Gap" intake manifold.
This will get you about 420 horsepower.

To get 500 horsepower you will need to port the heads with also installing large valves and use a Trick Flow "Track Heat" single plane intake manifold.
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Re: 460 Ford build

Post by F-BIRD'88 » Tue Mar 07, 2017 12:32 am

If you want a Girlie HFT cam for it that will work well street and strip w 10:1cr
a Comp cams XE284H-10 #34-250-4 will get it done. W single plane or dual plane
Use the right springs. Can move it around a bit to fine tune.
its not a bad off the shelf street cam at all.

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Re: 460 Ford build

Post by mag2555 » Tue Mar 07, 2017 6:39 am

Even the DOVE heads flow enough on the stock Intake side to make 500 hp with a single plane Manifold, so whatever heads you go with even a 68 to 72 % Exh to Int ratio is good if you are running headers and a duel pattern Cam.

Do not port match the Exh side all the way as the headers will pick up 3 to 5 percent more flow above .400" lift if the Exh port flange is left close to a 1/16" smaller than the inlet of the header.

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Re: 460 Ford build

Post by DanE2 » Tue Mar 07, 2017 7:43 am

My C9 heads flow 331/199 CFM @ .6" with 2.2" intake valves and 1.75" exhaust valves. Ported. That's about a .6 ratio exhaust flow to intake flow. With these ported stock heads you have to forget about the so called "ideal" exhaust to intake ratio and make up the difference with camshaft duration split. It works.

Get all you can out of the intake side and try to get the exhaust flow in the 190 to 200 range. Same with the C8,C9,Dove or the D3's. They will all make about the same HP. With a proper set up, these stock passenger car heads can make in the 700 to 750 horsepower range. The Cobra Jet passenger car heads can make considerably more.

With a ported Blue Thunder, dual plane, dual quad intake manifold, my C9 heads with the intake and carbs bolted to the heads, flowed 315 CFM. My engine is set up as a high torque engine in a 5000 pound car. Camshaft is a SFT (no girlley cam) with 242/255 (.610/.630) 112. 502 cubic inches with 10.76 CR (measured).

prairiehotrodder; I used the SCAT 6.7" rod and a .030 over SRP piston with a 22 cc dish, with a 4.15" stroke. (.034" quench) It is proven that this engine responds well to the 4.15" stroke, as well as a 4.3" and a 4.5" stroke.

I refer to my engine in this thread only as a reference to the 385 series engine. In my opinion, it is an underrated and misunderstood engine that has a ton of potential.

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Re: 460 Ford build

Post by mag2555 » Tue Mar 07, 2017 9:18 am

They do have a ton of potential, but not with factory iron heads who's Exh ports do no better then 145 cfm!
Any motor will make more greater power earlier in its rpm range when you do not have to crutch it with a duel pattern Cam!
I find it nessary to step up to a 1.75" Exh valve just to get the low lift flow anywhere near what it should be for good blow down!
The last set of late model marine heads I did for a fellows boat took me 1.75 hours per Exh port including the valve job just to yank 185 cfm out of them!!

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