Tailgate porting..

General engine tech -- Drag Racing to Circle Track

Moderator: Team

Old as Dirt
Pro
Pro
Posts: 286
Joined: Thu Oct 08, 2009 12:09 pm
Location: Monroe Washington

Re: Tailgate porting..

Post by Old as Dirt » Mon May 11, 2015 12:29 pm

Appreciate all the replies.. thanks..
I will continue getting the rough porting done on both heads after I have the first port where I think I want it.. in regards to width at the pushrod pinch/height at the SSR/intake entry and throat diameter under the VJ and make templates so I can make the rest of the ports the same.. then will do a final clean up with some sanding rolls to smooth everything up..

Haven't run this combination before, so no way of telling if I improved or destroyed the heads.. if the latter, no big deal as they were 50.00 + the surface/guides and the valve job.

As far as going with a different cam, or having another core reground.. probably not a bad idea, but feel like trying to make this one work first.
It may take the rest of the Summer to get this project rolling because of budget restraints, but will provide updates along the way as progress is made..

Would like to thank all who have replied.. without this site, and the awesome motorheads here.. finding info of value is tough and very time consuming.. just not enough time in a day. :D

fastblackracing
Member
Member
Posts: 81
Joined: Sun Feb 15, 2015 12:13 am

Re: Tailgate porting..

Post by fastblackracing » Mon May 11, 2015 12:32 pm

A couple of questions Old as dirt, First how tall of a tire do you plan on running?........26 or 28 will make a big difference at the big end.......... I would be tempted to advance that cam another 2*-4*, closing that intake as early as you can will help. And If you PM me your address next time I get to the post office I can send you an inch reading indicator as I came into a few extras from a plant we closed out last fall and I certainly would like to share the bounty........ I also think she will like more timing, I helped a friend with a similar deal last year had a comp 248*/248* .525 solid that ran good for what it was......I pretty much wore out a set of tires on it getting the carb and ignition dialed in.......Bravo to you for taking this on not everything has to be a hi roller build theres a part of me that that misses those days and I do have an 010 short block that got stashed away bout 20 years ago.......

Old as Dirt
Pro
Pro
Posts: 286
Joined: Thu Oct 08, 2009 12:09 pm
Location: Monroe Washington

Re: Tailgate porting..

Post by Old as Dirt » Mon May 11, 2015 1:54 pm

Fastblack.. the tires we had planned on using are 27" Goodyear slicks or the 26" Drag radials.. FBird had also mentioned moving the cam some, so I will try advancing it a bit more and close up the intake a bit earlier.. current IVC is 74* and brings by calculated DCR to 7.88 with a SCR of 10.7
I'm still undecided about building too much cylinder pressure/running a mix of race gas and premium pump or keeping the late close/running premium pump/working with the fuel and ignition curves to get it to behave.. I suppose getting it dialed in and using the required fuel(what ever it takes) is a sound practice..

As far as getting the timing settled.. yep, big dome and bad flame travel will require somewhere in the neighborhood of 40* or so to get it to run right, will start locked out @ 36* w/ Vacuum advance adding another 10* - 16* under light load and sneek up on it from there.. making sure Mr.Rattle is held at bay with good fuel, and then try it on Premium pump and see if it likes it...

Really appreciate you offering the indicator.. I have a few Starrett dials.. but none of them have the travel to check lift like I need.. I am getting pretty good at doing the conversion from MM - Decimal.. but a PITA and another step in a process that would become simpler.. Thank You!
I will send you a PM here shortly..
Regards,
Ken

Old as Dirt
Pro
Pro
Posts: 286
Joined: Thu Oct 08, 2009 12:09 pm
Location: Monroe Washington

Re: Tailgate porting..

Post by Old as Dirt » Fri Oct 16, 2015 10:29 pm

Been 5 months..

Haven't had a chance to finish the porting on the heads as of now.. wife bought me a 18'3" 1977 Sanger Flatbottom for my 60th birthday the middle of May(had to drive to Arizona to get it).. been spending a lot of my free time getting it set up.. just got the solid roller 496 running a couple of weeks ago, and have more to do before getting it painted(strip the boat bare and start the bodywork) this winter..

Today I found a new Holley 300-25 single plane manifold on CL for 60.00 and have a Holley 750DP(9379) w/annular boosters lined up for 200.00.. so I am looking forward to getting the little "355" back on the list of things to get done.. put the "EPS" manifold and 650DP on the Elky a while back.. runs great and has good manors.. lot's of projects.. not so much time... Son bought an 08 Dodge Cummins 2500.. so the little Elky sits in the driveway.. shame..

Here is a link to the "Sanger" starting up for the first time.. fresh 12:1 motor on 100ll AvGas.. sold the Kinsler Injection, the belt driven fuel pump, the Vertex mag and the zoomie headers that came with the boat(set up for Alcohol).. afforded me to pick up a "Team G" single plane, an 1150 Dominator, headers and ignition.. Looking forward to getting it out on the water this coming spring after paint.. My new "Lake Hotrod" is getting painted the same color as the Elky.. Cyber Gray Metallic.

You know what we are going to tow her to the lake with.. ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7t--R8pUPM

Carnut1
Guru
Guru
Posts: 3775
Joined: Tue Jun 11, 2013 6:32 pm
Location: Melbourne fl.

Re: Tailgate porting..

Post by Carnut1 » Sat Oct 17, 2015 6:51 am

Nice project and sounds snappy too! Built a 460 chevy about 24 years ago for a friend's 19'. I ported a set of Merlin rectangular port heads. I never heard it run but he had it for years and stated it was "Insane!". Look forward to both these projects!
Servedio Cylinder Head Development
631-816-4911
9:00am - 9:00pm EST

E.R. Racing
New Member
New Member
Posts: 21
Joined: Mon Jul 22, 2013 4:01 pm

Re: Tailgate porting..

Post by E.R. Racing » Sat Oct 17, 2015 7:46 am

Old as Dirt wrote:Been 5 months..

Haven't had a chance to finish the porting on the heads as of now.. wife bought me a 18'3" 1977 Sanger Flatbottom for my 60th birthday the middle of May(had to drive to Arizona to get it).. been spending a lot of my free time getting it set up.. just got the solid roller 496 running a couple of weeks ago, and have more to do before getting it painted(strip the boat bare and start the bodywork) this winter..

Today I found a new Holley 300-25 single plane manifold on CL for 60.00 and have a Holley 750DP(9379) w/annular boosters lined up for 200.00.. so I am looking forward to getting the little "355" back on the list of things to get done.. put the "EPS" manifold and 650DP on the Elky a while back.. runs great and has good manors.. lot's of projects.. not so much time... Son bought an 08 Dodge Cummins 2500.. so the little Elky sits in the driveway.. shame..

Here is a link to the "Sanger" starting up for the first time.. fresh 12:1 motor on 100ll AvGas.. sold the Kinsler Injection, the belt driven fuel pump, the Vertex mag and the zoomie headers that came with the boat(set up for Alcohol).. afforded me to pick up a "Team G" single plane, an 1150 Dominator, headers and ignition.. Looking forward to getting it out on the water this coming spring after paint.. My new "Lake Hotrod" is getting painted the same color as the Elky.. Cyber Gray Metallic.

You know what we are going to tow her to the lake with.. ;)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7t--R8pUPM
I like what you're doing. Smart man for doing it outside rather than getting the shop all messy. Just make sure you're wearing a mask.... those particles are small and can do damage to your lungs.

cuisinartvette
Guru
Guru
Posts: 1527
Joined: Fri Sep 05, 2008 11:39 pm
Location: Valencia Ca

Re: Tailgate porting..

Post by cuisinartvette » Sat Oct 17, 2015 6:46 pm

Like watching the home grown builds something simple and fun about it keep the posts coming

JoePorting
Guru
Guru
Posts: 2557
Joined: Mon Jun 14, 2010 3:16 pm
Location: Lake Elizabeth, CA

Re: Tailgate porting..

Post by JoePorting » Mon Oct 19, 2015 3:25 am

If you really want to save money in the long run and have a nice performing car, throw those heads on a shelf (or in the trash) and get a new set of AFR #1040 195 heads (or something similar). You can get them on ebay for around $1500. You can probably get a used set for $1000. That may sound like a lot of money, but if you take those old heads and buy new valves, valve seats, guides, springs, retainers, locks, seals, rocker studs, and then pay for the machine work such as a valve job, guide install, valve seat install, screw in rocker stud install, and flat mill, you'll be into them for over $1500 and they'll still be near junk heads. I see guys do this all the time and they always regret it. Once you start throwing good money after bad like in this situation, it's hard to stop.

It's even more painful if after all of the above you find out that the heads are cracked and useless. Therefore, relatively speaking, new heads are cheap and offer the most bang for the buck in performance and reliability.
Joe Facciano

My427stang
Expert
Expert
Posts: 681
Joined: Fri Sep 09, 2005 11:04 pm
Location: Omaha, NE
Contact:

Re: Tailgate porting..

Post by My427stang » Mon Oct 19, 2015 10:35 am

I agree that modern heads are the best bang for the buck, but sometimes we build what we have to or want to. So good on ya.

With your combo though, if you measured carefully at 10.7:1, I'd consider cranking that cam forward 2 degrees, or even 3 to a 103 ICL. It doesn't seem like much, but it'd make it a bit more polite on the street IMHO and with 10.7:1 compression it should allow it assuming normal carb and ignition tuning.

I'll add that if the front cover was on, I'd be hard pressed to take it apart again LOL but if it wasn't I'd likely advance it
70 Mustang, 489 FE, TKO-600, Massflo SEFI, 4.11s
71 F100 SB 4x4, 445 FE, hot rod 4x4

Old as Dirt
Pro
Pro
Posts: 286
Joined: Thu Oct 08, 2009 12:09 pm
Location: Monroe Washington

Re: Tailgate porting..

Post by Old as Dirt » Thu Oct 22, 2015 10:20 am

JoePorting wrote:If you really want to save money in the long run and have a nice performing car, throw those heads on a shelf (or in the trash) and get a new set of AFR #1040 195 heads (or something similar). You can get them on ebay for around $1500. You can probably get a used set for $1000. That may sound like a lot of money, but if you take those old heads and buy new valves, valve seats, guides, springs, retainers, locks, seals, rocker studs, and then pay for the machine work such as a valve job, guide install, valve seat install, screw in rocker stud install, and flat mill, you'll be into them for over $1500 and they'll still be near junk heads. I see guys do this all the time and they always regret it. Once you start throwing good money after bad like in this situation, it's hard to stop.

It's even more painful if after all of the above you find out that the heads are cracked and useless. Therefore, relatively speaking, new heads are cheap and offer the most bang for the buck in performance and reliability.
Thanks Joe.. top notch advise, and will give it a lot of thought.. the "once you start throwing good money" deal hits home.. already regretting the 450.00 I have into a set of 50.00 heads.. time to stop the bleeding..

Carnut1
Guru
Guru
Posts: 3775
Joined: Tue Jun 11, 2013 6:32 pm
Location: Melbourne fl.

Re: Tailgate porting..

Post by Carnut1 » Tue Apr 10, 2018 2:16 pm

Old as Dirt wrote:
Thu Oct 22, 2015 10:20 am
JoePorting wrote:If you really want to save money in the long run and have a nice performing car, throw those heads on a shelf (or in the trash) and get a new set of AFR #1040 195 heads (or something similar). You can get them on ebay for around $1500. You can probably get a used set for $1000. That may sound like a lot of money, but if you take those old heads and buy new valves, valve seats, guides, springs, retainers, locks, seals, rocker studs, and then pay for the machine work such as a valve job, guide install, valve seat install, screw in rocker stud install, and flat mill, you'll be into them for over $1500 and they'll still be near junk heads. I see guys do this all the time and they always regret it. Once you start throwing good money after bad like in this situation, it's hard to stop.

It's even more painful if after all of the above you find out that the heads are cracked and useless. Therefore, relatively speaking, new heads are cheap and offer the most bang for the buck in performance and reliability.
Thanks Joe.. top notch advise, and will give it a lot of thought.. the "once you start throwing good money" deal hits home.. already regretting the 450.00 I have into a set of 50.00 heads.. time to stop the bleeding..
Any chance of an update? Thanks, Charlie
Servedio Cylinder Head Development
631-816-4911
9:00am - 9:00pm EST

tresi
Pro
Pro
Posts: 270
Joined: Sun Mar 24, 2013 10:10 pm

Re: Tailgate porting..

Post by tresi » Tue Apr 10, 2018 9:27 pm

Welded rocker studs? How do you keep from killing the heat treating in the studs? Doesn't cost that much to do it right. Get the tapping guide and use the studs without the hex if you're trying to stay out of the machine shop.

tresi
Pro
Pro
Posts: 270
Joined: Sun Mar 24, 2013 10:10 pm

Re: Tailgate porting..

Post by tresi » Tue Apr 10, 2018 9:35 pm

The locked out distributor is ok for the track but with your compression you're going to have a lot of detonation

Old as Dirt
Pro
Pro
Posts: 286
Joined: Thu Oct 08, 2009 12:09 pm
Location: Monroe Washington

Re: Tailgate porting..

Post by Old as Dirt » Wed Apr 11, 2018 8:29 am

Sometimes life gets in the way of our "Projects" and the little things take longer to achieve.. Sold the El Camino, Sanger as well.. trashed the heads and the 355 sits on an engine stand in the shop waiting for attention..a lot of things change in 3 years.. maybe I'll have time to play with them this year. :oops:

williamsmotowerx
Expert
Expert
Posts: 727
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2007 1:24 pm
Contact:

Re: Tailgate porting..

Post by williamsmotowerx » Wed Apr 11, 2018 6:02 pm

How much did you sell the El Camino for? I've been looking for one

Post Reply