Engine Masters

[LCaverly]

Looks like pontiac is out of the picture unless I want to sleeve all eight holes or find an early block (pre 58) , sure wouldn't make for a cheap build. I don't know why they just didn't specify a cubic inch limit within stock stroke and bore limitations.
Len C

[wyrmrider]

77-81 301 small journal block was 4"
the pre 58 was 3 15/16 -- would they go 60 0ver?
421-428 crank with the mains turned down?
but it depends on the heads
which E heads (and manifolds) flow the best will win this one
Mickey Thompson Hemi heads would be a winner- they are NOT Chrysler Hemis

How bout an Ardun Ford in the old motor category?
or W2 or later heads on a Poly
Weight does not mater racing dynos
astrally the Poly heads can be made to work well

[Walter R. Malik]

Looks like pontiac is out of the picture unless I want to sleeve all eight holes or find an early block (pre 58) , sure wouldn't make for a cheap build. I don't know why they just didn't specify a cubic inch limit within stock stroke and bore limitations.
Len C

Personally, I think a Pontiac could be the engine of choice.
NONE of them are going to be cheap Len, simply "spec". But, installing a sleeve intended for a 390 Ford in all 8 holes of a 400 block would certainly be cheaper than any aftermarket block. Cut down the mains of an OEM 428 crank and you're there.

Finding a virgin 389 block would be about impossible.

[LCaverly]

Randy think the pontiac could be very competitive also, but its unlikely to be able to find a 389 with a stock bore, I have 3 and all will have to be a minimum of .030 over so I'am thinking 57 347 block .060 over, will give up a few inches but already have 4" crank for it.
Len C PS also know crazy crank grinder in Mich. could set me up

[wyrmrider]

what's wrong with the widely available 301- no experience with those
still
which

edelbrock heads are the best

[wyrmrider]

it's not which edelbrock head is the best but who has the best cnc program or port job, which head has the largest intake valve to start off with
BTW I do not see where inserts for the Ford exhaust are prohibited, or do Edelbrock heads need them?

Cleveland 2.05 190cc 1.6 ex
Buick 2.125 215cc 1.75 ex
Pontiac 2.11 215cc 1.66 ex
Olds 2.072 288cc 1.68 ex

www.edelbrock.com/automotive/mc/cylinder-heads/
gives relatively the same advertised flows for ewac h motor
http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive/mc/ ... data.shtml
but looks like Buick and Pontiac give the most to work with
wonder how they limit valve sizes like with cleveland part number which is bare head which does not have valves?

[Walter R. Malik]

it's not which edelbrock head is the best but who has the best cnc program or port job, which head has the largest intake valve to start off with
BTW I do not see where inserts for the Ford exhaust are prohibited, or do Edelbrock heads need them?

Cleveland 2.05 190cc 1.6 ex
Buick 2.125 215cc 1.75 ex
Pontiac 2.11 215cc 1.66 ex
Olds 2.072 288cc 1.68 ex

http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive/mc/cylinder-heads/
gives relatively the same advertised flows for ewac h motor
http://www.edelbrock.com/automotive/mc/ ... data.shtml
but looks like Buick and Pontiac give the most to work with
wonder how they limit valve sizes like with cleveland part number which is bare head which does not have valves?

When you can't weld on the head ... the metal has to be there originally.
By rule, valve sizes must remain how Edelbrock produced THAT complete head.
The Pontiac has the biggest valves and the Olds is next because, Buick has no decent small block even near the correct bore range let alone fit those heads.
By the rules, the way they are presently written, there are big blocks which fit into the rules package. There are presently no legal manifolds for the Buick or Olds small block ... I would think they will change those particular rules but, maybe not.

There are 4 other classes in the contest.

[tjs44]

The 301 is a inch shorter deck,it is a little work to get a non 301 head to work with the block.Joe Sherman and I did a 383 301 using a 326 3 3/4 stroke crank.It needed a spacer on the thurst because of the diff from the 301.Not sure how the rules would work with the block.Im sure its strong enough for EMC pulls.Tom

[user-9274568]

I'm going to build a 460 cid 23º. Unlimited manifold, unlimited carb, I think I can make 700+ ft. lbs.

[SchmidtMotorWorks]

The vintage rules look rather wide open, what is the history of those closing up and disqualifying builds in progress?

[900HP]

I'm going to build a 460 cid 23º. Unlimited manifold, unlimited carb, I think I can make 700+ ft. lbs.

That would actually be pretty cool except it wouldn't qualify as a "V8 production passenger car big block engine type"

[LCaverly]

I'm thinking DCI motor sports big block RA V pontiac at 500 cubes would be a good combination if allowed. Will call Don and see if he is up for it.
Len C

[tjs44]

in the past they would not allow V heads.Tom

[wyrmrider]

Walter
When you can't weld on the head ... the metal has to be there originally. But how about the tounghns slid in and retained by the header flange?
But IDK if they are needed with the E heads since
"Intake and exhaust ports based on 2V design"
not the 4v head

For the Cleveland they spec the bare head 60609
with the note about recommended valve sizes and that larger valves may be used
not the complete head with valves 60629 like they do with the other motors
perhaps they would want to change the spec number

On the Buick
I would think any block that those "small block" spec heads fit on would be legal
after all the Buick is the second lightest in the day two comp
I'd ask about a 400 if I was a Buick guy-- Bore is not Big like 455

[Walter R. Malik]

I'm thinking DCI motor sports big block RA V pontiac at 500 cubes would be a good combination if allowed. Will call Don and see if he is up for it.
Len C

Unless there is a coming change to those rules ..."Cylinder heads must retain the passenger car production port configuration".