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SBC 383 build Advice shooting for 550hp to 600hp

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Re: SBC 383 build Advice shooting for 550hp to 600hp

Postby wyrmrider » Wed Jun 26, 2013 6:06 pm

from post 1
Car is a 1984 monte carlo ss that will see mostly street
(and just a little on the track).
4 Speed 700r4 w/ 4.11 gear & Power Brakes
so a medium weight. some would say heavy car and nothing about a high stall converter (or headers?)
the low gear in the 700r4 and the 4.11's help
so let's not make a race car project out of this nice street project
I'd even question the manifold with a stock converter or mild street converter
big joe would be the one to ask on that
is this a daily driver or a cruse night special?
no more than pump gas?
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Re: SBC 383 build Advice shooting for 550hp to 600hp

Postby cuisinartvette » Wed Jun 26, 2013 6:10 pm

your camgrinder or cam king or big joe could advise you

x2.

Think what joes saying is hes seeing those #s from his builds not necessarily the same as yours.
Two guys to really listen to. If it was only 520hp but ripped on the street would it matter?

Seen a few builds with much smaller HRs same heads claiming huge power #s dont believe everything you read. There may be some out there but-
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Re: SBC 383 build Advice shooting for 550hp to 600hp

Postby af2 » Wed Jun 26, 2013 7:35 pm

Desmosis10 wrote:

On my Afr 210c competition cylinder heads [b]they flow at 318 intake and 235 exhaust at a 600 lift Super Sucker spacer whats your advice on using the carb spacer 1 or 2 inch???" What do u mean by what my quench??? Also the intake i'm using is a MOTOWN single plane rpm range on the intake is 2500-7000


With an engine that needs maybe 260 on the flow to make the speed get there why do you think the heads flowing 318/ forget the exhaust . It is what it is/ heads? Time to think and understand what is needed.
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Re: SBC 383 build Advice shooting for 550hp to 600hp

Postby af2 » Wed Jun 26, 2013 7:42 pm

af2 wrote:
Desmosis10 wrote:

On my Afr 210c competition cylinder heads [b]they flow at 318 intake and 235 exhaust at a 600 lift Super Sucker spacer whats your advice on using the carb spacer 1 or 2 inch???" What do u mean by what my quench??? Also the intake i'm using is a MOTOWN single plane rpm range on the intake is 2500-7000


With an engine that needs maybe 260 on the flow to make the speed get there why do you think the heads flowing 318/ forget the exhaust . It is what it is/ heads? Time to think and understand what is needed.



Squish/ quench is also part of what you need when building the short block...
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Re: SBC 383 build Advice shooting for 550hp to 600hp

Postby Orr89rocz » Wed Jun 26, 2013 7:57 pm

Heres a mild one i was looking for, as a reference. Very mild

383, 10.5:1 comp, afr 1040's 195cc heads
Mike jones 228/228 hyd roller. I think .360" lobes

Designed for a big TPI injected setup but dyno'd with a victor sp and carb
513 hp at 5800, 500 lb ft 5000 rpm
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=PGxdLjAhH3A

Thats a mild cam. 10 deg more and more lift more head it should get close to 550
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Re: SBC 383 build Advice shooting for 550hp to 600hp

Postby Desmosis10 » Wed Jun 26, 2013 8:31 pm

wyrmrider wrote:from post 1
Car is a 1984 monte carlo ss that will see mostly street
(and just a little on the track).
4 Speed 700r4 w/ 4.11 gear & Power Brakes
so a medium weight. some would say heavy car and nothing about a high stall converter (or headers?)
the low gear in the 700r4 and the 4.11's help
so let's not make a race car project out of this nice street project
I'd even question the manifold with a stock converter or mild street converter
big joe would be the one to ask on that
is this a daily driver or a cruse night special?
no more than pump gas?


well its going to be a driver not everyday tho mostly weekend car, and yes its going to be a pump gas car 97 octane 3500 stall converter 1 3/4 - 1 7/8 headers. Its just a going to be a mean street Muscle car that looks good sound good and performance good.
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Re: SBC 383 build Advice shooting for 550hp to 600hp

Postby Desmosis10 » Wed Jun 26, 2013 8:48 pm

cuisinartvette wrote:
your camgrinder or cam king or big joe could advise you

x2.

Think what joes saying is hes seeing those #s from his builds not necessarily the same as yours.
Two guys to really listen to. If it was only 520hp but ripped on the street would it matter?

Seen a few builds with much smaller HRs same heads claiming huge power #s dont believe everything you read. There may be some out there but-


yeah that's true if it was 520hp and I'm having fun in it, it shouldn't matter but if I can get more I willing to do it. An yes your right don't believe everything u read I just look at some engine builders like Cnc-motorsports on YOUtube that have lots of engine dyno videos on 383 strokers that have smaller cams and heads thats doing well over 510HP, So i believe I can get in the 550hp range some how some way i'm just saying... who knows really
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Re: SBC 383 build Advice shooting for 550hp to 600hp

Postby Desmosis10 » Wed Jun 26, 2013 8:52 pm

af2 wrote:
Desmosis10 wrote:

On my Afr 210c competition cylinder heads [b]they flow at 318 intake and 235 exhaust at a 600 lift Super Sucker spacer whats your advice on using the carb spacer 1 or 2 inch???" What do u mean by what my quench??? Also the intake i'm using is a MOTOWN single plane rpm range on the intake is 2500-7000


With an engine that needs maybe 260 on the flow to make the speed get there why do you think the heads flowing 318/ forget the exhaust . It is what it is/ heads? Time to think and understand what is needed.


why do I think the heads flow at 318 on the intake. Well the AFR book tells u they flow at 318 on a 600 lift Afr website does and I called them and they told me the same thing. So that's pretty much facts I guess...
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Re: SBC 383 build Advice shooting for 550hp to 600hp

Postby wyrmrider » Wed Jun 26, 2013 11:17 pm

couple of questions just saw your latest post after I typed this so some revisions
3/8 rocker studs??
what's your deck height with your chosen pistons, please say 0.0 (and adjust piston to get compression)
your "quench" would be your gasket thickness- the closer the better
on your cam choice
did Comp say to squeeze the lobe centers-comp recommends for 9:1 and 3000 stall and use 110 LC and 106 ICL
but no mention of 383
my take is that is a conservative (but not very conservative) cam
236 @50 can be done with 280 @.006 not needing 288 still with .360 lobe lift and mid 150's @200
or
same seat timing @.006 288 can have more "intensity" to get you over 240@.050 and over 160 @200 and over .360 lobe lift
you could have .620 at the valve with 1.7 rockers
If you already have the comp cam 1.7 rockers would get you around .600 lift on the intake
so what converter??? OK I see you said 3500 that really helps (and tranny cooler)
If daily driver I'd go with the shorter duration higher lift solution no matter what seat duration you can live with
8 degrees is a lot to leave on the table
I may comment on Orr 89's post above
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Re: SBC 383 build Advice shooting for 550hp to 600hp

Postby wyrmrider » Wed Jun 26, 2013 11:33 pm

Orr
I don't see a 228 duration with 360 cam lift on Mike's site
but I do see
220 @50 142 @ 200 and .375 lift with only 272 on the seat @.006 should work good with power brakes and AT .637 w/ 1.7 rockers
142 @200 would give plenty of flow
he also show
227@.050 148@.200 .375 lift and 280 on the seat which would be closer to the one you mention
as I said above 8 degrees on the seat makes a big difference
the comp cam suggestion is bigger- 288 on the seat but I do not know how big at 200 and does not have the lift
for those still suggesting a 240 @.050 cam are you thinking of over 160 @200? and around 288 on the seat?
Mike would be much better at discussing his lobes than me finding his catalog
narrowing down the choice to maximize across the intersection power- 60 ft time- with a 3500 stall converter and 4.11s and still make the brakes work
what powerband are you looking for Des?
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Re: SBC 383 build Advice shooting for 550hp to 600hp

Postby Orr89rocz » Thu Jun 27, 2013 7:08 am

I think mike can cut lobes off his catalog lobes if needed but i didnt see a 228 deg at .050 either. Thats what the guy says he has. Its fairly mild but still made some juice so possibly the OP can get 520's hp without goin to a 236-240's cam. Thats a good bit of duration for a hyd roller and will require 6500+ rpm to get the most out of it. Not a problem with good bottom end but good bit of lope and make it abit more pita to drive, especially cruise without accurate timing and fuel control like in an efi setup

I think you can get your 525 goal with a 280's adv 230-236 deg at .050 cam with afr 210's. comp magnum high lift lobes could do well here. Or even xe high lift but thats going to be hard on the valvetrain.
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Re: SBC 383 build Advice shooting for 550hp to 600hp

Postby wyrmrider » Thu Jun 27, 2013 8:27 am

comment to af2
OP is in between that rock and a hard place
in order to fully use the heads he needs more lift into the area where they flow best than he can get with seat durations he can use with a 3500 rpm stall heavy car and 4:11s and power brakes
A race car would be easy, lower gears and spin the motor and run optimum duration for high horsepower
a light car he could use more stall and gears
If he wanted a race type narrow power band he could get more top end horsepower
HP at high rpm looks good but if he looses torque at stall the car will be a pita to drive unless he is very hard core
(been there- done that- built a Chevele SS turbo 400 car for a customer too big a cam and ended up changing it, it was great out on the road when you hit passing gear but till then... )

another comment
who was using 97 octane and where do you get it? (or was that the other 383 thread)?
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Re: SBC 383 build Advice shooting for 550hp to 600hp

Postby CamKing » Thu Jun 27, 2013 8:40 am

Orr89rocz wrote:Heres a mild one i was looking for, as a reference. Very mild

383, 10.5:1 comp, afr 1040's 195cc heads
Mike jones 228/228 hyd roller. I think .360" lobes

Designed for a big TPI injected setup but dyno'd with a victor sp and carb
513 hp at 5800, 500 lb ft 5000 rpm
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=PGxdLjAhH3A

Thats a mild cam. 10 deg more and more lift more head it should get close to 550

The duration may be short, but it's not mild. The lobe profile is very aggresive, and requires the "high-dollar" Morel lifters.
It's 276@.006", 228@.050", 150@.200"
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Re: SBC 383 build Advice shooting for 550hp to 600hp

Postby Orr89rocz » Thu Jun 27, 2013 9:57 am

The duration may be short, but it's not mild. The lobe profile is very aggresive, and requires the "high-dollar" Morel lifters.
It's 276@.006", 228@.050", 150@.200"


I say mild as in lower duration, street compression, afr 195's, etc. engine runs well and is a good street motor with good drivability. I didnt have the other numbers for the cam duration and lobe lift, just knew the .050 numbers.
It sure produced a stout package with lower rpm range use.
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Re: SBC 383 build Advice shooting for 550hp to 600hp

Postby CamKing » Thu Jun 27, 2013 11:37 am

Orr89rocz wrote:It sure produced a stout package with lower rpm range use.

Yes, but not something you want to throw in with a bunch of mis-matched parts, and cheap lifters.
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