Synthetic oil for Flat Tappet cams

General engine tech -- Drag Racing to Circle Track

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stokerboats
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Re: Synthetic oil for Flat Tappet cams

Post by stokerboats »

There was a time when flat tappets started failing but I'm thinking it was more due to the loss of domestic lifter manufacture than it was to oil changes. This is a subject in and of itself. On my existing flat tappet bbc, now 7 years in service with spring pressures very in the middle of what were already posted by others (140-150 psi) and with a cam in the mid 260*@ .050 range with .656 lift I am fairly happy with the oils chosen over time. Originally with dino 20/50 for a couple years driving 30 miles each way to the track I watched my oil pressure drop from 72 psi to 68psi after a few miles at rpm on the freeway once the engine was up to 180-195 degrees depending of course on ambient temp. I was always bothereed by the psi drop in the oil so I thought I'd try something different. I switched to RP auto parts store 20/50 and 40z of comp 159 additive and noticed that while at temp on the freeway the oil pressure did not drop below the 72 psi mark at rpm. (2000^) I then after a period got an idea to see what would happen if I switched to the RP auto parts blend 10w30 and zddp plus. I found that this made no difference at all at rpm and have stuck with this up until today with no failure whatever. This is not any scientific test by any stretch and is contrary to 540 Rat's testing but I just can't stop using what has been successful to me for a long while. I'd rather be the dumber guy who's been lucky than to try something which is said to be better and risk a rebuild as a result. My 2 cents.
GARY C
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Re: Synthetic oil for Flat Tappet cams

Post by GARY C »

Order a case of this and run what ever oil you want! Oil Extreme Concentrate additive. http://www.oilextreme.com/enter.html
I have run several flat tappet cammed small and big blocks with this and Mobil 1 with no failures.
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Re: Synthetic oil for Flat Tappet cams

Post by pdq67 »

Gary,

Order which one??

Part # please.

pdq67
greg
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Re: Synthetic oil for Flat Tappet cams

Post by greg »

forget bout all the Nonsense bout Zinc it all bs as said here on proven oil tests on ths forums oreillys house bran is 1 of the best oil made ...thats right House brand look it up on ths forums,,,oreillys house bran oils 3.80 a quart,,,dont ad additives to it;; :D.....i run isky solid flat tappet cam the biggest isky makes fer a slmallblock solid flat tappet 200 passes no wear,,,127,10.40,,3700 lb car,,forget all the useless nonsense about rollers if u run a quarter mile save ur money an go to hooters an hav som fun hahahah :lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Synthetic oil for Flat Tappet cams

Post by GARY C »

pdq67 wrote:Gary,

Order which one??

Part # please.

pdq67
The Concentrate Additive about 3/4 down the page, I didn't see a part #
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Re: Synthetic oil for Flat Tappet cams

Post by mshred »

Well if anything all of these posts have me more up in the air then before...I also thought 540rat was someone I could listen to, but in my other thread have oodles asking him to stop peddling his "crap" so im even more confused now lol.

I saw Mobil 1 15W50 on the shelf today at the auto parts store...it said high performance on the front...but I never got to take a closer look as I was in a hurry. What about it makes it better or even suitable for flat tappet use? Or will the thicker viscosity actually increase my oil temps compared to the BP 10W40 im currently using?

What about European blends? Apparently they are ok to use?
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Re: Synthetic oil for Flat Tappet cams

Post by GARY C »

mshred wrote:Well if anything all of these posts have me more up in the air then before...I also thought 540rat was someone I could listen to, but in my other thread have oodles asking him to stop peddling his "crap" so im even more confused now lol.

I saw Mobil 1 15W50 on the shelf today at the auto parts store...it said high performance on the front...but I never got to take a closer look as I was in a hurry. What about it makes it better or even suitable for flat tappet use? Or will the thicker viscosity actually increase my oil temps compared to the BP 10W40 im currently using?

What about European blends? Apparently they are ok to use?
Do you know who David Vizard is?
Do you know his distaste for additives?
If so you can understand why he has put his reputation on this product....It's not for financial gain, I can attest to that first hand
If you did know DV you would know why I and others here trust Oil Extreme, if nothing else give them a call and see what you think.
Don't take my word for it, PM 900HP or Swatson454 on this site and get their opinion on it.
Maybe they will chime in.
Please Note!
THE ABOVE POST IN NO WAY REFLECTS THE VIEWS OF SPEED TALK OR IT'S MEMBERS AND SHOULD BE VIEWED AS ENTERTAINMENT ONLY...Thanks, The Management!
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Re: Synthetic oil for Flat Tappet cams

Post by 540 RAT »

mshred wrote:Well if anything all of these posts have me more up in the air then before...I also thought 540rat was someone I could listen to, but in my other thread have oodles asking him to stop peddling his "crap" so im even more confused now lol.

I saw Mobil 1 15W50 on the shelf today at the auto parts store...it said high performance on the front...but I never got to take a closer look as I was in a hurry. What about it makes it better or even suitable for flat tappet use? Or will the thicker viscosity actually increase my oil temps compared to the BP 10W40 im currently using?

What about European blends? Apparently they are ok to use?
Mshred, those who asked me to stop peddling my, umm......info, are simply brainwashed by the old wive's tale about needing high zinc levels for high protection, and are not qualified to know one way or the other. And I will NOT stop posting the truth, people have the right to know the facts. Those naysayers simply DO NOT know what they are talking about. The high zinc believers have NO TEST DATA to back up anything they say. They only believe that MYTH because everyone else believes it. And that is simply NOT PROOF of anything. So, you can believe those folks who are not Engineers, and have nothing to support their claims. Or you can believe me, a working Professional Degreed Engineer, and a Member of SAE (Society of Automotive Engineers) who has actually been performing "dynamic motor oil testing under load", at the representative normal operating temperature of 230*F. I back up what I post with that real world test data. My test data is the real deal. How can anyone not understand that a real world test, which is good enough to produce very closely repeatable results, is far better than any mere propoganda?

I have been attacked regularly be unqualified people who just can't believe that high levels of zinc aren't what they've been cracked up to be. Well, those zinc lovers have simply been gullible enough to believe a MYTH that has clearly been BUSTED. Unqualified people declared that low zinc oils caused component failure, because they didn't know what they were doing, and could not perform proper root cause failure analysis. The actual cause was poor component quality, NOT a change in the oil.

My test data is consistent with that GM oil report that I've posted links to. It is also consistent with the fact that most major Oil Companies have always said to NOT add anything to their carefully balanced additive packages in their oil. My test data facts speak for themselves. The fact is, some high zinc oils provide outstanding wear protection, and some high zinc oils DO NOT. We still see flat tappet lobes occasionally get wiped even with high zinc oils. There was and example of that just a couple of weeks ago over on the Chevelle Forum. So, you simply cannot trust that an oil with a high level of zinc will protect your motor. You have to perform some kind of dynamic wear testing under load, as I have done, to find out which oil is good and which oil is not so good. It's the same thing with low zinc oils, some provide outstanding wear protection, and some do not. And again, you have to perform some kind of dynamic motor oil wear testing under load, as I have done, to find out which oil is good and which oil is not so good.

I've challenged those naysayers to PROVE any of my testing, along with that GM oil report, and the fact that most major Oil Companies have always said to NOT add anything to their oil, are all wrong. But, they can never come up with anything beyond what they "think" is correct, or what some lame Internet links say. We test engines on dyno's to see how they really perform, instead of just looking at a build sheet. It's the same thing regarding my "dynamic motor oil wear testing under load", to see how the oils really perform, rather than just looking at its zinc level on some Lab Test print out. Zinc is NOT the only extreme pressure additive package component available to Motor Oil Chemical Engineers. This is all very straight forward info, and does not require a PhD to understand.

Bottom line:
DO NOT let those who don't know what they are talking about, confuse you. You "CAN" listen me, because I only post the facts from real world testing, where others do not. And when I challenge the naysayers to prove my test data invalid, they never can. You can decide for yourself who makes the most sense to believe. For the facts, here is my "wear protection ranking list", once again:

NOTE: The higher the psi value, the BETTER the wear protection. And this applies to ANY engine, including High Performance flat tappet engines.

Oil categories for gasoline engines:

• Over 90,000 psi = OUTSTANDING wear protection

• 75,000 to 90,000 psi = GOOD wear protection

• 60,000 to 75,000 psi = MODEST wear protection

• Below 60,000 psi = UNDESIRABLE wear protection




1. 5W30 Pennzoil Ultra, API SM synthetic = 115,612 psi
I have not been able to find this oil with the latest API SN certification. The bottle says, “No leading synthetic oil provides better wear protection”. For once, a product’s hype turns out to be true. And this oil provides MORE THAN TWICE as much wear protection as the lowest ranked oil on this list.
zinc = 806 ppm
phos = 812 ppm
moly = 66 ppm

2. 10W30 Lucas Racing Only synthetic = 106,505 psi
zinc = 2642 ppm
phos = 3489 ppm
moly = 1764 ppm
NOTE: This oil is suitable for short term racing use only, and is not suitable for street use.

3. 5W30 Mobil 1, API SN synthetic = 105,875 psi
zinc = 801 ppm
phos = 842 ppm
moly = 112 ppm

4. 0W30 Amsoil Signature Series 25,000 miles, API SN synthetic = 105,008 psi
zinc = 824 ppm
phos = 960 ppm
moly = 161 ppm


5. 10W30 Valvoline NSL (Not Street Legal) Conventional Racing Oil = 103,846 psi
zinc = 1669 ppm
phos = 1518 ppm
moly = 784 ppm
NOTE: This oil is suitable for short term racing use only, and is not suitable for street use.

6. 5W50 Motorcraft, API SN synthetic = 103,517 psi
zinc = 606 ppm
phos = 742 ppm
moly = 28 ppm

7. 10W30 Valvoline VR1 Conventional Racing Oil (silver bottle) = 103,505 psi
zinc = 1472 ppm
phos = 1544 ppm
moly = 3 ppm

8. 10W30 Valvoline VR1 Synthetic Racing Oil, API SL (black bottle) = 101,139 psi
zinc = 1180 ppm
phos = 1112 ppm
moly = 162 ppm

9. 5W30 Chevron Supreme, API SN conventional = 100,011 psi
This oil only cost $4.29 per quart at an Auto Parts Store when I bought it.
zinc = 1018 ppm
phos = 728 ppm
moly = 161 ppm

10. 5W20 Castrol Edge with Titanium, API SN synthetic = 99,983 psi
zinc = 1042 ppm
phos = 857 ppm
moly = 100 ppm
titanium = 49 ppm

11. 5W30 Pennzoil Platinum, API SN synthetic = 99,949 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD

12. 20W50 Castrol GTX ,API SN conventional = 96,514 psi
zinc = 610 ppm
phos = 754 ppm
moly = 94 ppm

13. 30 wt Red Line Race Oil synthetic = 96,470 psi
zinc = 2207 ppm
phos = 2052 ppm
moly = 1235 ppm
NOTE: This oil is suitable for short term racing use only, and is not suitable for street use.

14. 0W20 Mobil 1 Advanced Fuel Economy, API SN synthetic = 96,364 psi
zinc = 742 ppm
phos = 677 ppm
moly = 81 ppm

15. 5W30 Quaker State Ultimate Durability, API SN synthetic = 95,920 psi
zinc = 877 ppm
phos = 921 ppm
moly = 72 ppm

16. 5W30 Castrol Edge with Titanium, API SN synthetic = 95,717 psi
zinc = 818 ppm
phos = 883 ppm
moly = 90 ppm
titanium = 44 ppm

17. 10W30 Joe Gibbs XP3 NASCAR Racing Oil synthetic = 95,543 psi
zinc = 743 ppm
phos = 802 ppm
moly = 1125 ppm
NOTE: This oil is suitable for short term racing use only, and is not suitable for street use.

18. 5W20 Castrol GTX, API SN conventional = 95,543 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD
NOTE: Oil numbers 17 and 18 were tested weeks apart, but due to the similarities in their wear scar sizes, their averages ended up the same.

19. 5W30 Castrol GTX ,API SN conventional = 95,392 psi
zinc = 830 ppm
phos = 791 ppm
moly = 1 ppm

20. 10W30 Amsoil Z-Rod Oil synthetic = 95,360 psi
zinc = 1431 ppm
phos = 1441 ppm
moly = 52 ppm

21. 5W30 Havoline, API SN conventional = 95,098 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD

22. 5W30 Valvoline SynPower, API SN synthetic = 94,942 psi
zinc = 969 ppm
phos = 761 ppm
moly = 0 ppm

23. 5W30 Valvoline Premium Conventional, API SN = 94,744 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD

24. 5W20 Mobil 1, API SN synthetic = 94,663 psi
zinc = 764 ppm
phos = 698 ppm
moly = 76 ppm

25. 5W20 Valvoline SynPower, API SN synthetic = 94,460 psi
zinc = 1045 ppm
phos = 742 ppm
moly = 0 ppm

26. 5W30 Lucas, API SN conventional = 92,073 psi
zinc = 992 ppm
phos = 760 ppm
moly = 0 ppm

27. 5W30 O'Reilly (house brand), API SN conventional = 91,433 psi
This oil only cost $3.99 per quart at an Auto Parts Store when I bought it.
zinc = 863 ppm
phos = 816 ppm
moly = 0 ppm

28. 5W30 Maxima RS530 Synthetic Racing Oil = 91,162 psi
zinc = 2162 ppm
phos = 2294 ppm
moly = 181 ppm

29. 5W30 Red Line, API SN synthetic = 91,028 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD

30. 5W20 Royal Purple API SN synthetic = 90,434 psi
zinc = 964 ppm
phos = 892 ppm
moly = 0 ppm

31. 10W30 Quaker State Defy, API SL semi-synthetic = 90,226 psi
zinc = 1221 ppm
phos = 955 ppm
moly = 99 ppm

32. 10W60 Castrol TWS Motorsport, API SJ conventional = 90,163 psi
This oil is manufactured in Europe and is sold in the US for BMW models M3, M5, M6, Z4M, and Z8.
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD

33. 5W20 Valvoline Premium Conventional, API SN = 90,144 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD

34. 5W30 Havoline, API SN synthetic = 89,406 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD

35. 30 wt Castrol Heavy Duty, API SM conventional = 88,089 psi
zinc = 907 ppm
phos = 829 ppm
moly = 56 ppm

36. 20W50 LAT Synthetic Racing Oil, API SM = 87,930 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD

37. 5W30 Valvoline Nextgen 50% Recycled Oil, API SN conventional = 87,563 psi
zinc = 947 ppm
phos = 778 ppm
moly = 0 ppm

38. 10W30 Joe Gibbs HR4 Hotrod Oil synthetic = 86,270 psi
zinc = 1247 ppm
phos = 1137 ppm
moly = 24 ppm

39. 5W20 Pennzoil Ultra, API SM synthetic = 86,034 psi
I have not been able to find this oil with the latest API SN certification.
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD

40. 15W40 RED LINE Diesel Oil synthetic, API CJ-4/CI-4 PLUS/CI-4/CF/CH-4/CF-4/SM/SL/SH/EO-O = 85,663 psi
zinc = 1615 ppm
phos = 1551 ppm
moly = 173 ppm

41. 5W30 Castrol Edge w/Syntec, API SN (formerly Castrol Syntec) black bottle, synthetic = 85,179 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD

42. 5W30 Royal Purple API SN synthetic = 84,009 psi
zinc = 942 ppm
phos = 817 ppm
moly = 0 ppm

43. 20W50 Royal Purple API SN synthetic = 83,487 psi
zinc = 588 ppm
phos = 697 ppm
moly = 0 ppm

44. 20W50 Kendall GT-1 High Performance with liquid titanium, API SN conventional = 83,365 psi
zinc = 991 ppm
phos = 1253 ppm
moly = 57 ppm
titanium = 84 ppm

45. 5W30 Mobil 1 Extended Performance 15,000 mile, API SN synthetic = 83,263 psi
zinc = 890 ppm
phos = 819 ppm
moly = 104 ppm

46. 0W20 Castrol Edge with Titanium, API SN synthetic = 82,867 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD

47. 5W30 LAT Synthetic Racing Oil, API SM = 81,800 psi
zinc = 1784 ppm
phos = 1539 ppm
moly = 598 ppm

48. 5W30 Peak, API SN synthetic = 80,716 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD

49. 5W30 Edelbrock "Cat-Safe", API SM synthetic = 78,609 psi
This oil is made for Edelbrock by Torco
zinc = 924 ppm
phos = 659 ppm
moly = 28 ppm

50. 15W40 ROYAL PURPLE Diesel Oil synthetic, API CJ-4 /SM, CI-4 PLUS, CH-4, CI-4 = 76,997 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD

51. 5W30 Pennzoil, API SN yellow bottle, conventional = 76,989 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD

52. 10W40 Chevron Supreme, API SN conventional = 76,806 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD

53. 5W30 Lucas API SM synthetic = 76,584 psi
zinc = 1134 ppm
phos = 666 ppm
moly = 0 ppm

54. 5W30 GM's AC Delco dexos 1 API SN semi-synthetic = 76,501 psi
zinc = 878 ppm
phos = 758 ppm
moly = 72 ppm

55. 5W50 Castrol Edge with Syntec API SN, synthetic, formerly Castrol Syntec, black bottle = 75,409 psi
zinc = 1252 ppm
phos = 1197 ppm
moly = 71 ppm

56. 5W30 Royal Purple XPR (Extreme Performance Racing) synthetic = 74,860 psi
zinc = 1421 ppm
phos = 1338 ppm
moly = 204 ppm
NOTE: This particular bottle of oil was just opened, but was out of a 3 ½ year old case.

57. 5W40 MOBIL 1 TURBO DIESEL TRUCK synthetic, API CJ-4, CI-4 Plus, CI-4, CH-4 and ACEA E7 = 74,312 psi
zinc = 1211 ppm
phos = 1168 ppm
moly = 2 ppm

58. 5W30 Peak, API SN conventional = 73,690 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD

59. 15W40 CHEVRON DELO 400LE Diesel Oil, conventional, API CJ-4, CI-4 Plus, CH-4, CF-4,CF/SM, = 73,520 psi
zinc = 1519 ppm
phos = 1139 ppm
moly = 80 ppm

60. 15W40 MOBIL DELVAC 1300 SUPER Diesel Oil conventional, API CJ-4, CI-4 Plus, CI-4, CH-4/SM, SL = 73,300 psi
zinc = 1297 ppm
phos = 1944 ppm
moly = 46 ppm

61. 15W40 Farm Rated Heavy Duty Performance Diesel Oil conventional CI-4, CH-4, CG-4, CF/SL, SJ = 73,176 psi
zinc = 1325ppm
phos = 1234 ppm
moly = 2 ppm

62. 15W40 “NEW” SHELL ROTELLA T Diesel Oil conventional, API CJ-4, CI-4 Plus, CH-4, CF-4,CF/SM = 72,022 psi
zinc = 1454 ppm
phos = 1062 ppm
moly = 0 ppm

63. Brad Penn, Penn Grade 1 Nitro 70 Racing Oil semi-synthetic = 72,003 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD

64. 0W30 Brad Penn, Penn Grade 1 semi-synthetic = 71,377 psi
zinc = 1621 ppm
phos = 1437 ppm
moly = 0 ppm

65. 15W40 “OLD” SHELL ROTELLA T Diesel Oil conventional, API CI-4 PLUS, CI-4, CH-4,CG-4,CF-4,CF,SL, SJ, SH = 71,214 psi
zinc = 1171 ppm
phos = 1186 ppm
moly = 0 ppm

66. 10W30 Brad Penn, Penn Grade 1 semi-synthetic = 71,206 psi
zinc = 1557 ppm
phos = 1651 ppm
moly = 3 ppm

67. 15W40 VALVOLINE PREMIUM BLUE HEAVY DUTY DIESEL Oil conventional, API CJ-4, CI-4 Plus, CI-4, CH-4, CG-4, CF-4, CF/SM = 70,869 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD

68. 15W50 Mobil 1, API SN synthetic = 70,235 psi
zinc = 1,133 ppm
phos = 1,168 ppm
moly = 83 ppm

69. 5W40 CHEVRON DELO 400LE Diesel Oil synthetic, API CJ-4, CI-4 Plus, CI-4, SL, SM = 69,631 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD

70. 30wt Edelbrock Break-In Oil conventional = 69,160 psi
zinc = 1545 ppm
phos = 1465 ppm
moly = 4 ppm

71. 5W30 Motorcraft, API SN synthetic = 68,782 psi
zinc = 796 ppm
phos = 830 ppm
moly = 75 ppm

72. 10W40 Edelbrock synthetic = 68,603 psi
zinc = 1193 ppm
phos = 1146 ppm
moly = 121 ppm
This oil is manufactured for Edelbrock by Torco.


73. 5W40 SHELL ROTELLA T6 Diesel Oil synthetic, API CJ-4, CI-4 Plus, CI-4, CH-4, SM, SL = 67,804 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD

74. 15W40 LUCAS MAGNUM Diesel Oil, conventional, API CI-4,CH-4, CG-4, CF-4, CF/SL = 66,476 psi
zinc = 1441 ppm
phos = 1234 ppm
moly = 76 ppm

75. 15W40 CASTROL GTX DIESEL Oil conventional, API CJ-4, CI-4 Plus, CI-4, CH-4, CG-4, CF-4/SN = 66,323 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD

76. 10W30 Royal Purple HPS (High Performance Street) synthetic = 66,211 psi
zinc = 1774 ppm
phos = 1347 ppm
moly = 189 ppm

77. 10W40 Valvoline 4 Stroke Motorcycle Oil, API SJ conventional = 65,553 psi
zinc = 1154 ppm
phos = 1075 ppm
moly = 0 ppm

78. 5W30 Klotz Estorlin Racing Oil, API SL synthetic = 64,175 psi
zinc = 1765 ppm
phos = 2468 ppm
moly = 339 ppm

79. “ZDDPlus” added to Royal Purple 20W50, API SN, synthetic = 63,595 psi
zinc = 2436 ppm (up 1848 ppm)
phos = 2053 ppm (up 1356 ppm)
moly = 2 ppm (up 2 ppm)

The amount of ZDDPlus added to the oil, was the exact amount the manufacturer called for on the bottle. And the resulting psi value here was 24% LOWER than this oil had BEFORE the ZDDPlus was added to it. Most major Oil Companies say to NEVER add anything to their oils, because adding anything will upset the carefully balanced additive package, and ruin the oil’s chemical composition. And that is precisely what we see here. Adding ZDDPlus SIGNIFICANTLY REDUCED this oil’s wear prevention capability. Just the opposite of what was promised. Buyer beware.

80. Royal Purple 10W30 Break-In Oil conventional = 62,931 psi
zinc = 1170 ppm
phos = 1039 ppm
moly = 0 ppm

81. 10W30 Lucas Hot Rod & Classic Hi-Performance Oil, conventional = 62,538 psi
zinc = 2116 ppm
phos = 1855 ppm
moly = 871 ppm

82. 0W20 Klotz Estorlin Racing Oil, API SL synthetic = 60,941 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD

83. 10W30 Comp Cams Muscle Car & Street Rod Oil, synthetic blend = 60,413 psi
zinc = 1673 ppm
phos = 1114 ppm
moly = 67 ppm
This oil is manufactured for Comp Cams by Endure.

84. 10W40 Torco TR-1 Racing Oil with MPZ conventional = 59,905 psi
zinc = 1456 ppm
phos = 1150 ppm
moly = 227 ppm

85. 10W40 Summit Racing Premium Racing Oil, API SL = 59,483 psi
This oil is made for Summit by I.L.C.
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD
NOTE: Summit discontinued this line of oil, as of spring of 2013.

86. 10W40 Edelbrock conventional = 59,120 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD
This oil is manufactured for Edelbrock by Torco.

87. 0W20 LAT Synthetic Racing Oil, API SM = 57,228 psi
zinc = TBD
phos = TBD
moly = TBD


88. “ZDDPlus” added to O’Reilly (house brand) 5W30, API SN, conventional = 56,728 psi
zinc = 2711 ppm (up 1848 ppm)
phos = 2172 ppm (up 1356 ppm)
moly = 2 ppm (up 2 ppm)

The amount of ZDDPlus added to the oil, was the exact amount the manufacturer called for on the bottle. And the resulting psi value here was 38% LOWER than this oil had BEFORE the ZDDPlus was added to it. Adding ZDDPlus SIGNIFICANTLY REDUCED this oil’s wear prevention capability. Just the opposite of what was promised. Buyer beware.


89. “ZDDPlus” added to Motorcraft 5W30, API SN, synthetic = 56,243 psi
zinc = 2955 ppm (up 1848 ppm)
phos = 2114 ppm (up 1356 ppm)
moly = 76 ppm (up 2 ppm)

The amount of ZDDPlus added to the oil, was the exact amount the manufacturer called for on the bottle. And the resulting psi value here was 12% LOWER than this oil had BEFORE the ZDDPlus was added to it. Adding ZDDPlus SIGNIFICANTLY REDUCED this oil’s wear prevention capability. Just the opposite of what was promised. Buyer beware.

90. “Edelbrock Zinc Additive” added to Royal Purple 5W30, API SN, synthetic = 54,044 psi
zinc = 1515 ppm (up 573 ppm)
phos = 1334 ppm (up 517 ppm)
moly = 15 ppm (up 15 ppm)

The amount of Edelbrock Zinc Additive added to the oil, was the exact amount the manufacturer called for on the bottle. And the resulting psi value here was a whopping 36% LOWER than this oil had BEFORE the Edelbrock Zinc Additive was added to it. Adding Edelbrock Zinc Additive SIGNIFICANTLY REDUCED this oil’s wear prevention capability. Just the opposite of what was promised. Buyer beware.

91. 10W30 Comp Cams Break-In Oil conventional = 51,749 psi
zinc = 3004 ppm
phos = 2613 ppm
moly = 180 ppm

92. “Edelbrock Zinc Additive” added to Lucas 5W30, API SN, conventional = 51,545 psi
zinc = 1565 ppm (up 573 ppm)
phos = 1277 ppm (up 517 ppm)
moly = 15 ppm (up 15 ppm)

The amount of Edelbrock Zinc Additive added to the oil, was the exact amount the manufacturer called for on the bottle. And the resulting psi value here was a “breath taking” 44% LOWER than this oil had BEFORE the Edelbrock Zinc Additive was added to it. Adding Edelbrock Zinc Additive SIGNIFICANTLY REDUCED this oil’s wear prevention capability. Just the opposite of what was promised. Buyer beware.

93. “Edelbrock Zinc Additive” added to Motorcraft 5W30, API SN, synthetic = 50,202 psi
zinc = 1680 ppm (up 573 ppm)
phos = 1275 ppm (up 517 ppm)
moly = 89 ppm (up 15 ppm)

The amount of Edelbrock Zinc Additive added to the oil, was the exact amount the manufacturer called for on the bottle. And the resulting psi value here was 22% LOWER than this oil had BEFORE the Edelbrock Zinc Additive was added to it. Adding Edelbrock Zinc Additive SIGNIFICANTLY REDUCED this oil’s wear prevention capability. Just the opposite of what was promised. Buyer beware.

94. 30wt Lucas Break-In Oil conventional = 49,455 psi
zinc = 4483 ppm
phos = 3660 ppm
moly = 3 ppm


540 RAT
swatson454
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Re: Synthetic oil for Flat Tappet cams

Post by swatson454 »

540 RAT wrote:[quote="mshred"
Bottom line:
DO NOT let those who don't know what they are talking about, confuse you.

540 RAT
Well, this part I believe. If you won't back up your "findings" with REAL WORLD data, i.e. breaking in and running aggressive, flat-tappet cams on that synthetic stuff, you've got NO business putting someone in the potential situation of wiping out an engine. What you've been doing is NOT cool.
Live in such a way that those who know you but don't know God will come to know God because they know you.
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Re: Synthetic oil for Flat Tappet cams

Post by wil8115 »

Rat, run your 540 with flat tappets and your 5-30 SN oil and let us know how long it lasts...
until then, your one arm bandit test doesn't prove much.
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Re: Synthetic oil for Flat Tappet cams

Post by rally »

RAT all due respect Sir, but i been asking you and others have in here, get yourself a flat tappett mule test motor and run your new synthetic oil in there. Lets see some results on the cam and lobe wear? What is so hard about that. Thats all we are asking. I want to believe you on these tests, but show me the proof. Lots of small block Chevy motors out there cheap, build a test stand, with guages, etc and test, and i mean test.
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Re: Synthetic oil for Flat Tappet cams

Post by BigBlocksOnTop2 »

Has anybody ever though or compute the actual contact patch of a flat tappet cam when the tappet is going over the nose. Meaning, if you were to stop everthing still and could measure contact area. I think it would be .003 wide and around .175 in length. Not much area and a reasonable mech cam thats around 320 to 340 lbs. open pressure. Working math out to come up with psi ? I'm probably thinking to hard about this, but its food for though and I like hotrod engines.
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Re: Synthetic oil for Flat Tappet cams

Post by lorax »

I wish I had a dollar for everytime 540 has posted that useless list on the internet, here and every other site that would let him.
Over and over. Talk about a total waste of band width
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Re: Synthetic oil for Flat Tappet cams

Post by 540 RAT »

stokerboats wrote:There was a time when flat tappets started failing but I'm thinking it was more due to the loss of domestic lifter manufacture than it was to oil changes. This is a subject in and of itself. On my existing flat tappet bbc, now 7 years in service with spring pressures very in the middle of what were already posted by others (140-150 psi) and with a cam in the mid 260*@ .050 range with .656 lift I am fairly happy with the oils chosen over time. Originally with dino 20/50 for a couple years driving 30 miles each way to the track I watched my oil pressure drop from 72 psi to 68psi after a few miles at rpm on the freeway once the engine was up to 180-195 degrees depending of course on ambient temp. I was always bothereed by the psi drop in the oil so I thought I'd try something different. I switched to RP auto parts store 20/50 and 40z of comp 159 additive and noticed that while at temp on the freeway the oil pressure did not drop below the 72 psi mark at rpm. (2000^) I then after a period got an idea to see what would happen if I switched to the RP auto parts blend 10w30 and zddp plus. I found that this made no difference at all at rpm and have stuck with this up until today with no failure whatever. This is not any scientific test by any stretch and is contrary to 540 Rat's testing but I just can't stop using what has been successful to me for a long while. I'd rather be the dumber guy who's been lucky than to try something which is said to be better and risk a rebuild as a result. My 2 cents.
Dan,

What you did with your oil is NOT contrary to my test data, it is simply a different type of test. My testing is worst case torture testing of motor oil to see how they compare at their limit, when the chips are down.

Your testing only showed that adding zinc additives, did not cause you to have a failure. However, you most certainly REDUCED the oil’s wear protection capability by putting that additive in there. And that made your margin of safety much LOWER than it was before you added the zinc additives. But, even though you reduced their wear protection capability, you did not reduce their capability to a low enough value to cause a failure. So, your testing only showed what you can get away with, for that particular combo.

Increasing your margin of safety is a good thing, reducing it is not. Hopefully you will use a better oil setup with your new build. There is no risk to using an oil that tests better than what you are using now. This stuff is not Rocket Science.

540 RAT
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Re: Synthetic oil for Flat Tappet cams

Post by 540 RAT »

lorax wrote:I wish I had a dollar for everytime 540 has posted that useless list on the internet, here and every other site that would let him.
Over and over. Talk about a total waste of band width
You have no idea what you are talking about. I dare you to "prove" with real data, that my list is useless. Put up or shut up, as they say :-)

540 RAT
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