Don Terrill’s Speed-Talk

Can anyone explain to me what the various grades of these fuels are used for? I have to pick one to use,vintage Triumph cycle race engine ,10.5 static compression ,maximum 7500 rpm.This engine will detonate with 93 octane pump gas.In the past I mixed 93 unleaded with 110 Sunoco leaded racing fuel for similar tuned engines.The race Sunoco is no longer readily available and mixing fuels is a pain..Leaded is nice for the valve seats......I understand some racing fuels may burn too slowly?
These are the VP fuel grades available at the Ohio Mile...Prices are per 5 gallons,not one gallon.

VP110 (107 Octane) $50

C12 (108 Octane) $65

Q16 (Oxygenated Octane 116) $80

C16 (117 Octane) $75

C 23 (Leaded 120+ Octane) $85

MR 12 (Leaded Oxygenated-87 octane MC) $110

U 4.4 (Leaded Oxygenated-103 octane MC) $70

VP113 (Leaded-Oxygenated Fuel-109 octane) $60

VP 100 (Unleaded / Oxygenated 96 octane Street Legal) $65

MS109 (Unleaded / 101 Octane) $70

VPR (Leaded Oxygenated-101) $55

C9 (Unleaded / Non-Oxygened-92 Octane) $50

C10 (Unleaded / Non-Oxygened-96 Octane) $65

T4 (unleaded-Oxygenated-93 Octane) $55

Goggle VP Racing Fuels, call their Teck people, always good to answer your questions, this time of year they use a lot of C-12 in racing snowmobiles up here, same in summer at the Drag races but I would be calling them because of the different burn rates vs compression etc.

If you have access to av-gas I would run it. VP 110 should be more than capable of replacing the Sunoco.

http://www.vpracingfuels.com/master-fuels-table

Thanks, I contacted VP fuels as suggested.I will post their answer when it comes... Thanks

I would use the VP-113.

I flat don't know, but I will say that there are guys burning spec. E85 in up to 17 to 1 CR dedicated race engines so please look into this.

pdq67

If I were stuck with VP fuels, I would use C12 or C44 for your application.

bluenose wrote:Goggle VP Racing Fuels, call their Teck people, always good to answer your questions, this time of year they use a lot of C-12 in racing snowmobiles up here, same in summer at the Drag races but I would be calling them because of the different burn rates vs compression etc.

Let the guys know if they are not sanctioned that VP Blue is the same fuel as C-12 just a different color and $35 dollars a drum cheaper...unless your fuel guy is scamming you.

Truckedup wrote:Can anyone explain to me what the various grades of these fuels are used for? I have to pick one to use,vintage Triumph cycle race engine ,10.5 static compression ,maximum 7500 rpm.This engine will detonate with 93 octane pump gas.In the past I mixed 93 unleaded with 110 Sunoco leaded racing fuel for similar tuned engines.The race Sunoco is no longer readily available and mixing fuels is a pain..Leaded is nice for the valve seats......I understand some racing fuels may burn too slowly?
These are the VP fuel grades available at the Ohio Mile...Prices are per 5 gallons,not one gallon.

VP110 (107 Octane) $50

C12 (108 Octane) $65

Q16 (Oxygenated Octane 116) $80

C16 (117 Octane) $75

C 23 (Leaded 120+ Octane) $85

MR 12 (Leaded Oxygenated-87 octane MC) $110

U 4.4 (Leaded Oxygenated-103 octane MC) $70

VP113 (Leaded-Oxygenated Fuel-109 octane) $60

VP 100 (Unleaded / Oxygenated 96 octane Street Legal) $65

MS109 (Unleaded / 101 Octane) $70

VPR (Leaded Oxygenated-101) $55

C9 (Unleaded / Non-Oxygened-92 Octane) $50

C10 (Unleaded / Non-Oxygened-96 Octane) $65

T4 (unleaded-Oxygenated-93 Octane) $55

110 is good up to 13.1 compression, I don't know why you would need any more, I have had several circle track guys go to 110 after blowing up to many 10.1 "pump gas" engines.

One of the other posters recommended AV Gas. I would caution against it. AV Gas is made to operate at altitude where the air is thinner and much cooler, and as a result, is a relatively "dry" fuel. It can be hard on cylinder walls. As others have suggested, ask the manufacturer.

jeff8407 wrote:One of the other posters recommended AV Gas. I would caution against it. AV Gas is made to operate at altitude where the air is thinner and much cooler, and as a result, is a relatively "dry" fuel. It can be hard on cylinder walls. As others have suggested, ask the manufacturer.

As mentioned above; do NOT us AVGAS in a racing engine.
Octane is only one of several properties that determine the correct fuel for a given application.
Do NOT expect the fuel supplier to know which fuel is best for your specific application. They do not know but often talk as if they really did know.

jeff8407 wrote:One of the other posters recommended AV Gas. I would caution against it. AV Gas is made to operate at altitude where the air is thinner and much cooler, and as a result, is a relatively "dry" fuel. It can be hard on cylinder walls. As others have suggested, ask the manufacturer.

Yep, it really beats up on those aircraft engines that drop out the sky like flies when the engines fail... What's the other one... it doesn't run well below 10,000 feet. Please.

Did anyone read the app? A 10.5 to 1 engine, wanting to add to pump gas to give it a little protection? I wonder how many thousands of successful race engines have been run on av gas over the years. Sure it may not be good or ideal for some, and the quality isn't the same as it once was, but I would much rather run it over pump gas if the cost was the same. For a 10.5 to 1 engine tune it for the fuel and it will run just fine.

Back again, try to find some regular unleaded gasoline w/o ethanol in it and add some KEMCO 130 Supreme real lead octane booster.

It has real Tetra-Ethyl Lead in it that's just like the stuff they used to put in "ethyl" gasoline to boost it's poor octane back when I was a kid.

pdq67

I've been running my supercharged 540 BBC on AV Gas for 2 years now, no problems, high quality fuel.

VP makes a product called "Red" it's 100 octane. It will be perfect for your application, and it's cheap compared to all the fuels you listed.