Another Solid Roller Failure.

[BlackoutSteve]

Bill, that's something I am going to double check. The +.125" out the bottom is my machine shop's advice. I assume he has done it before..
I think the base circle is 1.1" and lobe is .420". That would be equivalent to 1.940".
Journal on these is 1.950" I think.. Should be fine.

[Belgian1979]

Just wondering if you're going to open the engine when it has run with the bushings to compare the wear.

[Wolfplace]

Just an update showing the bronze sleeves that arrived today. (Thank you for hand-balling them to me Mike. )

This picture crudely shows one lifter on the base circle and one at full lobe lift of 0.420", with the bushing at the installed heights.
Above the oil waist-band, there will now be about double the support and alignment compared to the standard length Mark4 bores.


I had the flanges made thicker for rigidity (1.125"OD, ~0.110" wall.)


..and a flange height of 7/16", which is as much as I could go while maintaining tie-bar clearance.
The bushing up-side-down, up to the flange, this is roughly how much taller the lifter bores will be.

You are welcome, glad I could help a little

[MadBill]

Should give significantly better support! Will you spot-face the bores for the bushing shoulders to seat on, or just trim them to the adjacent valley contours?

[BlackoutSteve]

Thanks again Mike..

Yes, I will be doing inspections and frequently at first. With the heads on, I am unable to get a bore gauge in any of them unless with an extension through a pushrod hole, but I reckon their splay will foil that plan.
I guess I decide to measure any bores based on the appearance of the lifter bodies and what I find in the filter.

The bores will need to be spot faced to provide a consistant height and proper seating.

Apart from the design of the lifters themselves being the issue (as suggested elsewhere) I am now out of ideas and soon will be out of cash...

[greg]

iam goin back to a solidlifter flat tappet,keep my $$ in my wallet,an not worry bout roller lifters coming apart an loosen another motor,called isky cant afford the prices of the roller stuff anyways,i have 2 roller cams 4 sale anybody wantem,280,284@50,660 lift an276,284 @50,there both onna 106..a set of 1 550new springs also,an another set of 1.550,,60runs on em,a flat tappet will do ok i believe only spinning 7,000..

[kirkwoodken]

I hope you carefully "stone by hand" any sharp edges in the oil band area. Just enough to remove any sharpness, if there should be any. Don't give the lifters any chance to dig in anywhere. No emery paper or Scotch bright. Small 1/2"X1/2"X6" stone. Wrap an oil soaked paper towel around the band to catch any grit. Getting rid of a sharp edge also promotes oiling on the sides. The reason automatic transmission shift valves have sharp edges is so they DON'T pass oil. You don't want radii on them.

[wyrmrider]

sharp edges push debris
rounded edges ramp over debris, debris scores and parts bind

[MadBill]

Good point. A radius could indeed ramp over particles but on the other hand, it can also form a kind crude hydrodynamic wedge for lubrication as it ramps over the oil...

[wyrmrider]

talking about sharp edges in valves in an AT valve body
plenty of oil
plenty of debris
sharp edges work, radius don't in that application

[Wolfplace]

talking about sharp edges in valves in an AT valve body
plenty of oil
plenty of debris
sharp edges work, radius don't in that application

Apples & oranges
How much side loading do those valve have?
Case in point the bottom of cylinder bores
Leave a nice sharp edge there & see what happens to the skirts & the side loading is minimal compared to a lifter
A sharp edge will tend to shear the oil off the surface of the lifter,, not a good idea

[kirkwoodken]

I'm hoping there will be no debris. IMO, you just can't put roller lifters in a non roller production block and expect everything to work right. Alignment and oil clearance are critical with rollers. The term "dropin lifters" hasn't helped the problem. I use a rev-kit in my street toy, which never sees over 7000 RPM by design, and cam stops pulling hard at 6600. And I don't have the parts screwed together which I bought from Wolfplace last summer. Got sidetracked by my "new" 55 Olds.

[Belgian1979]

How is the engine doing Steve ?

[BlackoutSteve]

I haven't yet even dismantled the short yet.
I have decided to make another alteration that will hopefully be another improvement, and that is to try a full bodied lifter such as the Morel Ultra Pro.
I just can't ignore the wear pattern low down in the bores that the Iskys left behind and these full bodied lifters simply have more surface area and that's what I think much of the problem is.
It's quite possible that the longer bushings would keep the Iskys aligned and that could fix the problem right there, but honestly I'm scared I'll ruin an expensive set of bushings..

So, now I'm waiting on these..

[Belgian1979]

I have a similar set in my SB. I believe Morel now sells the bushed lifters as well.