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NHRA Super Stock racing question

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NHRA Super Stock racing question

Postby jrod2sc » Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:02 am

Does a car in super stock have to run its OEM ci in NHRA super stock?

Specifically, I have a 69 Camaro that was originally manufactured with a 6 cylinder. Can I race it in super stock with a 350, if I put a comparable OEM 350 in it following all the specification guidelines as outlined by the NHRA (i.e. approved heads, etc.). I don't want to invest a lot of money in building the engine if they won't allow me to race it in super stock.

I have the NHRA rule book and I cannot find anything that specifically addresses this question in the super stock section.

Any help would be greatly appreciated.
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Re: NHRA Super Stock racing question

Postby Baprace » Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:24 am

Yes it will be fine, on side note there is not much Super Stock about those engines, they are very high dollar altered engines, you may want to rethink the class you run, mayby stock might be a little easier to compete in. Just look at the SS-A Hemis they can run 8.70's all day long. JMO
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Re: NHRA Super Stock racing question

Postby jrod2sc » Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:35 am

Thanks for the reply.

And yes those Darts can move. They move so well that they gave them their own class.

The only reason why I was thinking SS was the flexibility in being able to use a non OEM rear end and transmission. But I will give it some more thought. Thanks again.
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Re: NHRA Super Stock racing question

Postby Baprace » Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:47 am

jrod2sc wrote:Thanks for the reply.

And yes those Darts can move. They move so well that they gave them their own class.

The only reason why I was thinking SS was the flexibility in being able to use a non OEM rear end and transmission. But I will give it some more thought. Thanks again.

I'm not talking the Dart's , it's the Barracuda's and Challengers that can run 8.70's or better, Jeg jr ran that number at Indy with ease and was over 150 mph ,I have been told a winning/ competitive altered set of GM super stock heads can run up to $7,500. good luck on your build, keep us posted.
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Re: NHRA Super Stock racing question

Postby jrod2sc » Thu Jan 13, 2011 4:41 am

Just out of curiosity, is the $7500 competitive altered set of GM super stock heads OEM or aluminum?

I was looking over stock Car classification guide for a 1969 Camaros and the index depends on a variety of factors. I was planning on building the engine with OEM heads option, which form the NHRA excel spread sheet, would be a 10.53 index (350, Auto, OEM heads) putting me roughly in the SS/H depending on the actual weight of the car.

Thanks for the info. First time getting into this and I got a lot to learn.
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Re: NHRA Super Stock racing question

Postby donc » Thu Jan 13, 2011 8:00 am

to run 1.20 under index , and having an engine built your looking at 30,000.00 and the zeros are in the right place!
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Re: NHRA Super Stock racing question

Postby dfree383 » Thu Jan 13, 2011 8:07 am

Yes thats $7500 to prep a set of OEM Cast heads as required by the rules. Not aftermarket aluminum stuff.....
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Re: NHRA Super Stock racing question

Postby MrBo » Thu Jan 13, 2011 9:42 am

There are Dart and World iron castings that they now allow. The port cc rules are the same.
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Re: NHRA Super Stock racing question

Postby Jay Roeder » Thu Jan 13, 2011 10:09 am

You can run any engine that would have been originally available in the car and be in traditional Super Stock classes. Or, you can run Super Stock GT and install ANY other GM engine in your GM car. Or, you can build a Super Stock Modified type combo like I am and build any GM combo that has factory part numbers on the heads,(such as SB2 stuff)or GMPP Iron heads, and have almost no engine rules short of carb size and meeting the lbs./cubic inch specs. It doesn't actually have to cost 30k if you don't care about setting the world on fire and just want to be able to run the index. By the way, the SS/AH cars smoked past 8.70's a loong time ago! Try 8.30's! Damn! :shock: Hope this helps.
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Re: NHRA Super Stock racing question

Postby Alan Roehrich » Thu Jan 13, 2011 1:54 pm

To run traditional classes, you'll have to run an engine that was available in a 69 Camaro from the factory. So, anything that is listed as installed in a 69 Camaro in the NHRA Stock Car Classification Guide, can be run in your 69 Camaro in the appropriate traditional Super Stock class.

To run GT classes, you need to use an engine that was factory installed in a GM car as listed in that same guide.

The biggest advantage to the modified classes in Super Stock is that you do not really have to tear the engine down for tech inspection the way you would for the traditional and GT classes.

Honestly, a 69 Camaro is only going to be really competitive in the traditional classes, simply because the GT and modified classes are populated with the slippery FWD conversion cars that are pretty much full tube chassis race cars. The aero package and the wheelbase gives them a considerable advantage.

We are going to run a 69 Camaro in SS/EA this year to go along with our 69 Camaro AA/SA car.

The small block combinations for the traditional class for the 69 Camaro have been "flogged" pretty hard. Both the 255 and 300 HP 350 engines are factored pretty hard. The 302 is stick only. We're running a 396/375 with aluminum heads.

You can figure at least around $20K for a barely decent Super Stock 396, I wouldn't build one myself for less than $25K, at least, not if the customer expected it to be reasonably competitive and last for long. A good set of heads, intake, and carburetor, will cost you over $15K easily. I don't really think a small block would be much less expensive.

If you want to be really fast, plan on spending at least $30K or more for the engine, and near $10K for the transmission and converter, or about that for a stick shift set up. And the car better be a truly modern back half car. There's a reason competitive cars sell for $80K.
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Re: NHRA Super Stock racing question

Postby jrod2sc » Thu Jan 13, 2011 3:58 pm

Thanks everyone for the info. It really helps.

My dad and I are trying to put together a car that we can have fun with in either S/or SS. He raced back in the early 70's, but things have changed so much.
We figured S or SS would allow us to race on a decent budget and have fun. Of course we would like to be somewhat completive, but we don't have unlimited funds.

As it sits right now, the 69 I speak of has the following after market options (the rest of the car is pretty much stock):
Engine: 502 with SCAT 4340 lightweight forged bottom end and holly 950 carb
Trans: Huges Turbo 400 with trans break and 4500 stall convertor
Balanced drive shaft coupled to a ford 9’’ and 31 spline axil
Other options: Cal Trac bars and full roll cage.

We are trying to see what it would take to bring it into SS (maybe S) running a 350. We want to have fun and would like to get as many runs out of the motor as possible. We figured (maybe we are wrong) that the 350 would give us the most bang for the buck. We were leaning towards the SS class so we could keep the trans and rear end setup.
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Re: NHRA Super Stock racing question

Postby dfree383 » Thu Jan 13, 2011 4:21 pm

Find something like the NMCA or some simple class to run what you have in. What about index racing?

The Stock and Super stock stuff isn't for budget minded people if you want to be halfway compeditive.
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Re: NHRA Super Stock racing question

Postby Alan Roehrich » Thu Jan 13, 2011 4:45 pm

If you want to run Stock, that's a little different. In Stock, you MUST run an engine and transmission (type, not exact transmission) found in the guide for the car.

You could not use the TH400 with the brake, nor the 9" in Stock. Not a big problem. Sell them, and replace them with a legal transmission, and one of the new 12 bolt rear ends from Mark Williams, or maybe Moser.

The problem with Super Stock is that you'll need to take your car to a good chassis builder and have a new 4 link system put in it, the wheel wells stretched, the cage modified to work with the new pieces, and the front crossmember will need to be heavily modified. You could drop $25K easy, plus the cost of modifying the 9", which negates the cost benefit of keeping it.

The two 350 engines, the 255 and the 300, have been flogged really hard, so you have to have a really good one to run around 1 second under, which you really need to do to be competitive in F,G, and H Stock, stick or automatic.

The 302 is also well flogged. And requires a 4 speed.

However, the 4 speed is pretty cool, fun to drive, and low maintenance. It also greatly reduces the odds of getting a heads up run against a car you can't beat. Most any of the combinations for the 69 Camaro can be run with a 4 speed, and you can put complete new Jerico set up in for under $7K. A good friend of mine, Kevin Helms, is a multi time champion (divisional and national) and event winner with his B/S 69 Camaro.

There are actually quite a few big block combinations that work pretty well for the 69 Camaro, especially with the 4 speed. The best one may be an iron head 396/375 4 speed. The draw back to the big block cars is that unless you run a 4 speed, the odds are good you'll run into a new Challenger or new Mustang that you cannot beat in a heads up race.

A nice competitive Stock Eliminator big block can be built for maybe $15K or so. No, it won't set records, and it won't beat a new Challenger or Mustang, but it will be competitive and fun, as well as not terribly expensive.
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