Best OEM blocks???

[Bob Hollinshead]

Getting to recent history....Bunkerhill , In. last nite. Jeg's super quick deal. Like you said.....40 cars showed up only 3 of them bbf..not very good percentage as you said. They qualified 1st, 3rd and 5th. At 8 cars they all were still in the show.....at 4 cars 2 were still in...at 2 cars 1 was still in...the girl that qualified 5th won the whole show...now the percentages are looking better.
My point is that results may be better than percentages.

I wonder how many oem blocks.

[Lem Evans]

None in the Fords and I suspect none in the other brands either .

[JBV-HEADS]

Keith,

You’re correct. I put the OEM in twice to qualify for everyone if Alan was a professional, chevy guru, or just a guy with SDS. The 7/16 BBC dimple was never an OEM item, only GM Performance option placed in at one of the shops that paid the price to GM for the designation. They could be bought outright or in crates from GMP also. Very few shops even know this as a lot of misinformation was put out by racers and such to try to make them legal in OEM classes. There is one questionable detail that I’ve never found or anyone has been able to provide outside hearsay. Was the first 20 L-88’s put in at St. Louis or later like the rest? The engine wasn’t built there.

Bill,

On using OEM, don’t unless the rules force you to. They are not as strong, flow as good, wind as tight or take shock very well. All of them have been cheapened by the bean counters. Aftermarket has been created to increase performance, survive harsher environments, and give an advantage over the OEM product. You can easily spend twice the amount trying to increase performance or strength in an OEM product. As for starting a fight. Don’t worry. Anytime you mention the word BEST, it will happen. Doesn’t matter if it is block, heads, cam, oil, sparkplugs or brand.

Paulie,

Pretty much as history has recorded it. And I find it pretty silly that a chevy guy would open the door in a Ford vs. Chevy comparison with an aftermarket aluminum head with Jon out there.


Sandford,

Far too often people get soo excited about hearing themselves talk that they miss the obvious.

earlier comment

Alan,

where are you going to pick those OEM rods up at, 50ft or are you going for the Olympic rod toss record. The BBC has most of the parts, but the rods. The Hemi would be my choice too in the hands of a good tuner. I did forget that one.

Joe

From this thread.

I’ll check you out later this week.

Rally,

Most of the guys here are proud of their names. Why not you? Please spend your money where you want. Follow who you chose. I understand this as good as anyone. I also understand someone must pay the purse and my job is to make sure it’s not my guys. They appear to be quite happy according to my phone bill. Good luck.

Lem,

Excellent examples. It befuddles me that someone would bring up aftermarket aluminum heads and then claim registration as a form of performance. This to offset historical data. I guess if we are going to go off into the wild of the summer of love, then the retort is the for sale classifieds and how many guys are DUMPING chevys. I guess it has the same relevance. None.

Keith again.

Sorry bud. Lady luck always wins. Keep her out of the way and it is a landslide for the package. It helps to be friends with her boyfriend Engineering. Follow his suggestions and he usually takes her away for the weekend . I’ll vote for the package after lady luck. Good luck.

Alan,

For someone who posts as much as you do, I haven’t found anything important . No logical progression in thought process. No ability to reach a conclusion. Just mouth off, throw a bunch of garbage into the pile and sneak off. I do have to give you consistency on the last one though . I just sold a motor in TN this last week. It might be to my liking to deliver it and help them tune it. You’ve made yourself interesting. Are you proud enough to tell us where you work. Mine is by my name. You seem to hide a lot except on the forums. Is that on purpose or just an accident? I’ll wait for your comment before I plan the next 2 weeks. Thanks.

[dfree383]

I'm not the least bit emotional about this. I'm not the one that flipped out.

The average guy is going to get more for his money from a big block Chevy, especially OEM block and OEM crank based. That's what the original poster asked about. It's not an uncommon question, or combination. And having been through it before, in detail, GM, Ford, and Mopar, I answered his question.

If that were not the case, you wouldn't see 100 Super Comp dragsters or Super Gas cars with big block Chevy engines, and 2-3 Ford or Mopar powered dragsters or cars in every field.

Just go to http://www.dragracecentral.com, and pull up any qualifying list for Super Street, Super Gas, Super Comp, or Top Dragster. Out of every 100 cars, there are 90 or more big block Chevy powered, and 2-3 each, at best, Ford or Mopar powered. It is true now, and it was true 20 years ago, back when everyone ran an OEM block and maybe a set of Dart or AFR heads.

Alan,

With all due respect, You are correct 20-30 years ago that a BB Chevy had a cost advantage over a BB Ford, but now days its probably the other way around as far a HP per $$ Spent when using an OEM Block an Crank Like the OP was asking.

Ford guys are making 600-700+ hp all the time with Factory 2 bolt Blocks, Cast Cranks and small port OEM Ford heads. Take a look at http://www.429-460.com theirs a guy with a Ranger Mud Drag Truck making 630ish (@ 466") on a stingy dyno and hes in it for about $3500 and thats more the norm with them, nothing at all exotic or Expensive. The Factory 2 bolt stuff is considered safe to 750+ (Can be used in much higher HP builds with proper work) and the Factory 4 bolt or by adding caps and preping properly guys are and have gone to 1000 hp+/- (and sometimes a whole lot more) on the factory block.

Add a set pof SCJ or P-51 Aluminum heads 800-950hp isn't a problem in a race engine. Myself and Charlie Evans built a 466" pump gas motor last year and got 750 hp with a set of well worked P-51's and those same heads are on a race car right now making 950hp (@557") and running 4.70's on an American Dragster. and its a very basic OEM Block, Wet Sump, Single 4 motor and no Vac pump.

Just for the record to the factory Iron Cobra Jet heads are not that rare and they will flow over 400cfm if modified correctly. Factory small port stuff will go 360ish too. I will also add that big exhaust ports are overrated and not necessary in making power as long as one doesn't use Chevrolet related knowlage in the build.

OEM Chevy big blocks are not superior in any way to a Ford, it just the fact that in the past sheer quanities of them being build have made people believe this.

Is really ashame that alot of builders are stuck in the mud believing that big block cheverolet's are the holy grail as thiers a whole bunch to be had in the 385 series BBF on a budget.

[F1Fever]

I'm hearing a lot of talk but not much to back it up.... I did leave a link to where a guy was claiming 1800 rwhp on a splayed & filled BBC ... let's see that with a Ford....

[rskrause]

OMG, grown men getting into an emotional "Ford v. Chevy" battle. There is very little difference between the two in terms of performance, depends who is setting them up. I still voted for the Chev due to the huge choice of parts.

Let's look at cylinder heads for example. What are the generally avaialable heads for each (BBC, Ford 385) that fit the idea of a modest priced build? Please add to my list and we will see who wins, I am sure my Chevy list is more complete, since that's what I know about more. Don't get excited that I missed some, I am sure I did. Just off the top of my head.

Chevy: Profiler, RHS, GM, Patriot, Summit house brand, Jegs house brand, Edelbrock, Brodix, TFS, AFR, World, Dart (11)
Ford: Profiler, Ford, TFS, Edelbrock (4)

[dfree383]

I'm hearing a lot of talk but not much to back it up.... I did leave a link to where a guy was claiming 1800 rwhp on a splayed & filled BBC ... let's see that with a Ford....

Feel free to go to 429-460.ford, The motors I'm mentioning are real and are running.

630hp 466" DOVE headed motor is owned by Karl Jett in Virginia and the 950hp 557" P-51 headed motor is owned and run by Bobby Shrewsberry of Ownesboro, Kentucky.

One more worth mention is a guy by the name of Frank Merkle out of Canada, Stock OEM Ford Block with C460 heads well over 1200HP dyno and track proven, but this one was on spray, not N/A like the others above.

How about Erika Oritz, 1500+hp Turbo T-Bird 385 series BBF, started off running a OEM Block........

[F1Fever]

630hp 466" DOVE headed motor is owned by Karl Jett in Virginia

you and Lem look to be quite the supporters at that site, anyways i find it odd that a 630 hp factory headed (D0VE) motor is worthy of name recognition like that. a guy builds a 630 hp BBC with factory heads in the next town and you've never heard of him b/c it's so common.

950hp 557" P-51 headed motor is owned and run by Bobby Shrewsberry of Ownesboro, Kentucky.

again, this is so common with the BBC that it's almost moot

How about Erika Oritz, 1500+hp Turbo T-Bird 385 series BBF, started off running a OEM Block

that 1500 plus was on a factory block? still not 1800 regardless

[dfree383]

630hp 466" DOVE headed motor is owned by Karl Jett in Virginia

you and Lem look to be quite the supporters at that site, anyways i find it odd that a 630 hp factory headed (D0VE) motor is worthy of name recognition like that. a guy builds a 630 hp BBC with factory heads in the next town and you've never heard of him b/c it's so common.

950hp 557" P-51 headed motor is owned and run by Bobby Shrewsberry of Ownesboro, Kentucky.

again, this is so common with the BBC that it's almost moot

How about Erika Oritz, 1500+hp Turbo T-Bird 385 series BBF, started off running a OEM Block

that 1500 plus was on a factory block? still not 1800 regardless

Different Strokes for Different folks, but if you believe the Fords are expensive, junk and not able to handle everything a chevy can..... Well your sadly mistaken and very uninformed.

Ford 466" mentioned was just something very recently dynoed and proven, OEM 2 bolt Block, Back Yard Ported DOVE heads, Factory Cast Crank, Ect.... About as Low buck as any compairable BBC build.

Please site some documented examples of a BBC with a $50 factory Block making 950HP, how about BBC with Flat Top pistons, Set of OEM Passenger car heads, factory cast crank making 630 NA for $3500.......

[F1Fever]

hey, this thread was about the strongest OEM block.. so far we have 1800 rwhp for the BBC as measured
1200 for the BBF (possibly 1500 haha), none for the BBM

Please site some documented examples of a BBC with a $50 factory Block making 950HP

wow, ripped from the salvage for $50, must not have even changed cam bearings....

now you're trying to make this all factory parts...
try:
L88, LS6, LS7, ZL1

I think a couple of those made around 600 hp in 60's race trim..

you don't have to go far to find big power with a bbc:
viewtopic.php?t=547

and a song comes to mind.... the beautiful people.... bara daduhdun

[dfree383]

hey, this thread was about the strongest OEM block.. so far we have 1800 rwhp for the BBC as measured
1200 for the BBF (possibly 1500 haha), none for the BBM

Please site some documented examples of a BBC with a $50 factory Block making 950HP

wow, ripped from the salvage for $50, must not have even changed cam bearings....

now you're trying to make this all factory parts...
try:
L88, LS6, LS7, ZL1

I think a couple of those made around 600 hp in 60's race trim..

you don't have to go far to find big power with a bbc:
viewtopic.php?t=547

and a song comes to mind.... the beautiful people.... bara daduhdun

But some how I've never heard of all those wonderful BBC's winning very much in the 60's..... coincidence???? I think not....... The Ford's and the Mopars where making the numbers and more too, so don't even bother going there. But we'll leave real Ford and Mopar motors out of this, we'll just use the Lincoln motor and keep things fair......

If the Flows on those 990's Rec Port HP heads are impressive to you, Your way behind the times, Similar sized valves and light porting gets the same number out of typical Small port BBF heads....... so wheres the real data in that thread???? Dyno info????

Like I've already mentioned the Factory Ford HP heads will go into the 400's and we won't even whip out the Boss Heads in full boogie trim. So keep trying.........

[F1Fever]

back up bro... 1800 RWHP show me

[dfree383]

back up bro... 1800 RWHP show me

Prove the 1800hp.......... and Stock Production Block .

[falcongeorge]

It's all subjective and many blocks are good blocks.

About THE most sensible statement in this ENTIRE thread. As far as the Mopar stuff, he mentioned using the 440 Source heads? Any decent 440 block is MORE than adequate for the power levels those heads are capable of generating. The 385 series can go head-to-head with the BB chevy, anything beyond that is just a brand-loyalty pissing match. FWIW, I have owned sbc's, an FE, an LA Mopar, and a few 383s/440s, so I dont have a horse in this race, but I have built both BBC's and 385 series Fords.

[tt 383]

Sorry, I have stayed out of this because I don't build engines for a living and I can only go off of what I have read and heard at the strip. bbm/bbf are more expensive, and when pushed to 1000 hp area and above they dont seem to be as capable as the chevy, especially the Tall Deck..... I have heard of the fords having oiling issues, and the mopars experiencing cap walk above 700 hp or so. Heads really have no place in the topic, it was about blocks. Might I add that the olds diesel as was mentioned is a great piece as is the ford modular both are very strong factory castings, that for their size are good for a huge amount of power. Seems that all the people that are running are doing so for a reason, they make power and do so cheaply/reliably.